Trivia Question: US Army Pre-CW Generals

[KillCalvalry]

I didn't know the answer to this until very recently......

The Regular US Army had 1 Major General, and 3 Brigadier Generals at the time of South Carolina's Succession. Who were they, in order of rank?

The Major General is easy: Winfield Scott.

Who were the other 3, in order of seniority?

[Le Ricain]

I didn't know the answer to this until very recently......

The Regular US Army had 1 Major General, and 3 Brigadier Generals at the time of South Carolina's Succession. Who were they, in order of rank?

The Major General is easy: Winfield Scott.

Who were the other 3, in order of seniority?

My guess:

Thomas Jesup 1818
William Haney 1858
Joseph Johnston 1860

[KillCalvalry]

My guess:

Thomas Jesup 1818
William Haney 1858
Joseph Johnston 1860

Thomas Jesup WAS a Brigadier General, and was Quartermaster Gen'l of the Army. But he died in office in January 1860. In fact, JE Johnston succeeded him.

JE Johnston was the most Junior Brig. Gen in the Regular US Army in December, 1860. CORRECT on that one.

No idea who William Haney was. No.

1 down, 2 to go..........

[Le Ricain]

David Twiggs 1846

[Henry D.]

Albert Sidney Johnston (1857/Brevet for his conduct during the "Utah War")?

Regards, Henry

[Le Ricain]

John E Wool 1841

Someone has scanned into the web the entire Official Army Register for 1858. Amazing.

http://www.historybroker.com/cdbooks/military/army58/open.htm

[KillCalvalry]

Correct. John Wool, David Twiggs.

Wool was the Sr. Brigadier, and was amazingly active in the Civil War, despite being VERY old. He didn't hold a field command, but did hold an important one, and served the country well.

Twiggs was vilified; not sure what else he could have done, but he was kind of a traitor.

The Wikipedia bio on JE Johnston claims he was the ranking US Army officer to resign. That is technically true, in that Twiggs didn't resign, he was cashiered first for surrendering his command.

[runyan99]

Hmm, I would have guessed Henry Halleck.

[Le Ricain]

My initial guesses were Halleck and Sam Cooper. However, in the back of my mind I knew of the US general who surrendered his forces to the State of Texas. I thought that the guy's name was Haney.

KillCalvalry, I think that your conclusion on Twigg's conduct in 1861 is perhaps too kind. Twiggs was in a difficult position because he could not reconcile his duties as an officer in the US army with his beliefs in States' Rights. In the end, he surrendered his command, which represented 20% of the standing US army, together with all of its cannon, supplies and forts without firing a shot. Had his second in command, a New Yorker, been in command it is doubtful that he would gone down without a fight or at the very least without destroying his equipment and supplies. Certainly, this is what the officials of the State of Texas believed.

[Jabberwock]

Halleck had retired from the army in 1854, and was a corporate lawyer (railroads or insurance, I think) in San Fransisco when the war started.

[Jabberwock]

The worst part of Twiggs conduct was that he surrendered his forces to the state of Texas, when Texas hadn't even seceded yet.

[KillCalvalry]

Actually it was after Texas's succession; that occured Feb 1, and Twiggs surrendered Feb 19th.

It's certainly an interesting "What If" with Twiggs, if he had actually been a Unionist commander rather than a traitor. Apparently, Ben McCulloch and 1000 Texas State Troops surrounded the main facilities in the state. What would have happened if there was a fight then and there, 2 months before Ft. Sumter? Would it have accelerated the events of 1861 forward? Would certain Confederate leaders from VA, NC, TN have fought then and there on the Union side, since their states had not yet suceeded? I don't know if Bobby Lee was in Texas at the time.

[KillCalvalry]

Actually, I was wrong, the legislature had voted for succession on Feb 1, but it was not as of yet official. So Texas had not succeeded. It's fair to say though that there wasn't much doubt they were heading that way.

[Jabberwock]

Lt. Col. Lee was there, he had been 3rd in command in Texas (acting commander in November & December) ... he was almost arrested by those troops under McCulloch while traveling through San Antonio on his way to WDC. He would not have surrendered his command. He would definitely have fought on the Union side if there was a fight in Texas.

Orders relieving Twiggs and putting Colonel Waite in command had been signed by Winfield Scott on January 28, but someone in the War Department (under John Floyd) decided to send them in the regular mail instead of telegraphing them. They arrived in San Antonio Feb 15, but Waite didn't get there for the change of command until Feb 19. Twiggs had surrendered on the 16th.

I agree Texas was headed that way, it was official after a referendum on Feb 23. (4-1 in favor of secession) Texas was admitted to the Confederacy March 2.

Catton has a good discussion of all this in The Coming Fury pp. 226-233.

EDIT: And here is where I was wrong. John Floyd had resigned as Secretary of War in December. Joseph Holt was the Secretary of War department when this happened.

[Jabberwock]

And here is where I was wrong. John Floyd had resigned as Secretary of War in December. Joseph Holt was the Secretary of War department when this happened.