squarian wrote:The Case of the Missing Parrotts:
Oh, and Moriarty seems to have made off with three Coastal Arty also - the preceding turn, I also bought the three Coastal guns in GA. No show.
squarian wrote:The Case of the Missing Parrotts:
squarian wrote:Oh, and Moriarty seems to have made off with three Coastal Arty also - the preceding turn, I also bought the three Coastal guns in GA. No show.
Coldsteel wrote:Hi everyone.
I have a question, So I just downloaded this new patch, and I started a new game as the Union. I have never had this happen before, but when I go to build some new Troops, nothing happens. They aren't built, and it doesn't say anything about it after I end my turn. . . . It's like I never even did anything / requested them. Is this a bug with the new update? Or am I just overlooking something?
I keep trying to build troops in Missouri and Maryland, to no avail.
Thanks in advance.
Coldsteel wrote:Hi Lodilefty,
Honestly, I currently occupy every city in Missouri. . . .
Does it go by whom the city prefers? (South over North)? So if I as the Union occupy Jefferson City, but it still favors the South say 75% to 25%, would it not create my toops then?
Just wondering, I never had this issue with 1.15 (My default Disc Version).
Thanks in advance!
caranorn wrote:Sorry but some of these changes sound awful and don't seem to reflect the historic reality of the ACW.
Confederate Forces in the Trans Mississippi were actually artillery heavy (look at the number of Confederate guns at Pea Ridge). Few if any of those pieces were built in the area. Many were from prewar arsenals (federal as well as state) and forts (bronze 6 pounders often). The more modern pieces were either imported, or recently captured from the Union. In AACW it is almost impossible to capture as many guns as were done historically...
In the end the force pools more or less simulate the capacity of a state to raise artillery. This should in no way be tied to WSU...
I'm not sure what you mean by needing a city to raise units other than militia. If by city you mean something other than a native village I guess I could agree (though Pike and Cooper raised a rather respectable brigade in the Indian territories). But if this actually means requiring a city level above 1 or so I'd have a problem. Historically brigades were formd at the front, that is on arrival of enough new regiments at the Army HQ's a new brigade would be formed and generally command given to the most senior regimental commander. Of course this is impossible in AACW. But any kind of "civilised" settlement should be able to assemble a sufficient force, in the end it's just a waypoint for regiments raised in a general vicinity...
I really hope historicity can be maintained as the priority in these patches. Some of the info about this most recent beta patch actually makes me regret Gray's no longer here. At least I knew he had a firm grasp of the conflict and would not let things like these pass unchecked...
P.S.: I don't have time to do major AACW historic research right now (and might not have for a year or two). So if we have no researchers left of the original beta team I'd beg to just slow down changeing design elements of the game so other volunteers can get up to speed on these issues (I will chime in anytime I notice a discussion and can find som spare time)...
squarian wrote:I don't understand this distinction. Historical as opposed to realistic would mean what exactly in this context?
lodilefty wrote:Of course we welcome your opinion
Of note: Gray made the changes to the DB requiring WSU etc.
City is a Level 4 or higher, I think... maybe it's level 2...
...and FYI, I've studied and read about the ACW since I was 1;)
lodilefty wrote:Of course we welcome your opinion
Of note: Gray made the changes to the DB requiring WSU etc.
City is a Level 4 or higher, I think... maybe it's level 2...
...and FYI, I've studied and read about the ACW since I was 1;)
lodilefty wrote:Dug in a bit:
Cityscapes change with size: 1-4 are Towns, 5+ are City (matching the on-line Manual)
Note also, that a location with WSU shows a factory on Cityscape.
ARkansas has no city >2 (Little Rock = 2)
MisOuri has only St. Louis > 2
So CSA has a problem, as Industrialization won't increase city size.
Shoot. Nertz...
I suppose we could change the MO and AR units to raise in towns, but the Artillery would still be constrained (AR Horse Arty, MO Siege guns) to WSU, meaning Industrialize and/or capture St. Louis.
Another choice would be to revise the Raise Area from just AR and MO to allow these to be raised elsewhere in the West.
..or we could make LittleRock bigger.
Obviously, this change (made last year in 1.16RC4a, but perhaps bugged until RC5 game engine) needs some more thought and testing....
caranorn wrote:As I can't dig through the official records, Sheas or my own research from several years ago right now I will just link to the order of battle for Confederate forces at Pea Ridge ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pea_Ridge_Confederate_order_of_battle ) and Wilson's Creek ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilson%27s_Creek_Confederate_order_of_battle ) to illustrate the presence of artillery from the non industrialised Trans Mississipi...
At Wilson's Creek there were 2 Arkansas and 2 Missouri batteries. I made no detail research on this battle (though I'd once planned to for a quad game covering early battles in the West (Wilson's Creek, Donelson, Pea Ridge and Shiloh)). So I can't comment on the actual strength and equipment of these batteries...
At Pea Ridge there were 3 Arkansas, 1 Texas (I'm pretty sure a battery is missing from the wikipedia oob as I recall one battery left behind on the riverline, yet all 4 of these present on the battlefield) and 11 Missouri batteries.
Much of this increase between Wilson's Creek and Pea Ridge is due to capturing Union guns, including modern pieces (the old batteries would receive the captured guns and the old not yet quite obsolete 6 pounders would be handled by new batteries).
Most of these batteries fielded 4 guns (often mixed calibres), a few less, maybe one or two more.
Very few if any of those guns were manufactured in the Trans Mississipi.
Another useful link to look at is http://web.archive.org/web/20080710202730/http://www.tarleton.edu/~kjones/confeds.html . I don't have the time to check all the relevant links found on that site (probably many dead links, at least that was the case the last time I went through this a while back), but I expect you will find quite a large number of non identical batteries from Missouri, Arkansas and Texas there which could not even partially have been equipped with locally produced guns...
Concerning brigade formations. When reading through the OR and other period documents you will rapidly come to the conclusion that these were mostly formed ad-hoc as I previously described. Forcing these units to appear in large cities (level 4 is indeed roughly what I'd feared) is unrealistic (even though obviously having them appear out of state is not an option for AACW(-I) either)...
lodilefty wrote:[*]$recHarbor and $recHarborWSU add to these the requirment of a port
- $recHarborWSU: Coastal and Fort Batteries, Ironclads, Monitors, Steam Frigates, Armored Frigates
squarian wrote:But in the example which starts this thread, I attempted to build Coast Arty in GA, which starts the game with two towns, Columbus and Augusta, which are Lvl 1 harbors and produce WSU (+1).
So is a "port" for this purpose a harbor some level higher than one? Do you know what that level is?
lodilefty wrote:Here's the word from the Master:
When buying a unit, or when the annual "AutoRaise" musters Militia, the location and requirements are:Example: if you are raising a unit in Missouri, you'll need at least 1 city with >50% MC and >25% Loyalty for the unit to appear. Additionally, you'll need a region with these values that produces WSU to buuild Artillery.
- $recWSU: Only raise in a region that is producing War Supply.
- This is WAD, KS, TX, MS, MO, AR require Industrialization to build artillery
- $recTown and $recCity use different probability on which city the unit gets built in Area (recCity squares the size of city)
- $recHarbor and $recHarborWSU add to these the requirment of a port
- $recHarborWSU: Coastal and Fort Batteries, Ironclads, Monitors, Steam Frigates, Armored Frigates
- $RecCap will only allow build in your Capital
- Army HQ Units
- $RecObj will only allow build in a controlled Objective
- Signal, Medical, Engineer, Naval Engineer, Baloons
- For all cases you need >=50% MC to build (and MC increases slowly with only small units in a newly captured region)
- For all cases you need >=25% loyalty to build in a region
I did some testing of these rules, and it appears to be WAD.
squarian wrote:But in the example which starts this thread, I attempted to build Coast Arty in GA, which starts the game with two towns, Columbus and Augusta, which are Lvl 1 harbors and produce WSU (+1).
So is a "port" for this purpose a harbor some level higher than one? Do you know what that level is?
Coldsteel wrote:Thanks Lodi!
I do believe this answers my original question on why I am not producing anything in the Great State of Missouri at the moment.
What's "MC" short for?
lodilefty wrote:Here's the word from the Master:
When buying a unit, or when the annual "AutoRaise" musters Militia, the location and requirements are:Example: if you are raising a unit in Missouri, you'll need at least 1 city with >50% MC and >25% Loyalty for the unit to appear. Additionally, you'll need a region with these values that produces WSU to buuild Artillery.
- $recWSU: Only raise in a region that is producing War Supply.
- This is WAD, KS, TX, MS, MO, AR require Industrialization to build artillery
- $recTown and $recCity use different probability on which city the unit gets built in Area (recCity squares the size of city)
- $recHarbor and $recHarborWSU add to these the requirment of a port
- $recHarborWSU: Coastal and Fort Batteries, Ironclads, Monitors, Steam Frigates, Armored Frigates
- $RecCap will only allow build in your Capital
- Army HQ Units
- $RecObj will only allow build in a controlled Objective
- Signal, Medical, Engineer, Naval Engineer, Baloons
- For all cases you need >=50% MC to build (and MC increases slowly with only small units in a newly captured region)
- For all cases you need >=25% loyalty to build in a region
I did some testing of these rules, and it appears to be WAD.
caranorn wrote:
Do we still have an AACW beta team? Maybe someone knows why Gray made these changes (and why he didn't tell us in the public forum)...
squarian wrote:I'm OK with the rule itself, but it would be nice to have some warning - either some kind of flag when the unit is selected indicating the conditions are lacking, or an event message post-hoc confirming the build was aborted. It would save me searching the map in disbelief ("but surely those guns are here somewhere!").
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