Germany Map Improvement Suggestion

[jastaV]

Here's Central Germany how it looks following some mods.

Modding of Region Names, (.RGN files) have to be regarded as a subject for discussion rather than a matter for official NCP mods.
The same is true for Graphic mods to regions lookout: .PNG -regions- files.

For details over this subject see:
http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?t=9950

We have, anyway at hand wide modding chances over structures placement: Cities, Towns, Fortresses, Depots.

In the picture you can see more changes to structure deployement in Berlin and Saxony areas.


Berlin Area
Fortresses overlooking main routes of access to Berlin have been added or moved.
-Spandau Fortress added to Eberswalde Region.
-Wittemberg Fortress added to Burg Region.
-Magdeburg Fortress moved to Uelzen Region.

The position of the 3 mentioned fortresses controlling the roads to Berlin is historical accurate and adds strategic depth to campaign planning.


Saxony
The main issue was moving Leipzig to a more topographically accurate position, so to not having this town along the Elbe river and so close to Dresden.
-Leipzig City moved to Halle Region.
-Wurzen Town added to Leipzig Region.
-Dresden City transformed into a Port River Fortress.


Notes
Regions are not and will not renamed!
So you'll have instances where a "moved" structure is set over a Region not matching its names.

An example
Leipzig City will figure out in Halle Region, while Wurzen Town will be in Leipzig Region.
We could think of Region names as countriside names not always matching Town/City names.
Anyway, for gaming attention will be focused over structure names beeing their control worth VPs, rather than region names.
It's of little importance having and adjacent Leipzig Region on map when you have properly located Leipzig City!


Of course I could go after scenery modding and even new sceneries editing without "moving" structures, at all.

I please NCP users to post here their comments as regard evidencing what's the solution they like.
I'll keep mind of it!

As regard the pool........

1. I LIKE REPORTED TOPOGRAPHIC MOD ACCORDING TO THE DESCRIBED TERM.

2. I PREFER THE DEFAULT MAP FOR MODS AND 3rd PARTY NEW SCENERIES.

[Franciscus]

I voted yes, mainly because any initiative toward correcting map errors in NCP is more than welcome. I must say that at least to me one of the things that have kept me from getting hooked in NCP as opposed to AACW are the sometimes rather ridiculous errors in the NCP map.
In AACW AGEOD was fortunate to have a Gray_Lensman that have dedicated the last year of his life to correct the railroads, etc. of this game's map. I think that was great, although quite frankly I would not be able to tell what were the mistakes before they got corrected (not being an american and not having extensive knowledge of USA geography, etc.).
In NCP, being a european that's different (for god's sake, how can I play a Peninsular campaign with "Beira" in the middle of Alentejo, Portugal; Cabo "Fisterra" instead of Finisterra, etc ).
Unfortunately, no map corrections have been done officially. Maybe that's because NCP was not that successful. But that may be an unfortunate vicious circle: lack of interest -> lack of improvements -> lack of interest... etc. leure:

[Rafiki]

Nice work, Jasta: I have always had an admiration for those who not only report errors, but also provide solutions for fixing them

[color="Blue"]I moved this to the "Help improve NCP"-forum, since it very much is about helping to improve NCP. I also renamed the thread to clarify what it is about[/color]

[jastaV]

Nice work, Jasta: I have always had an admiration for those who not only report errors, but also provide solutions for fixing them

[color="Blue"]I moved this to the "Help improve NCP"-forum, since it very much is about helping to improve NCP. I also renamed the thread to clarify what it is about[/color]

Indeed I opened this thread because I was in the need to know NCP gamers' opinion before going on with my Germany, April 1913 Scenery.
Also, because of other modders going after 1813 Campaign mods, even if with different start dates, I guessed a good choice to attempt to coordinate ideas over best solutions for the common operational Theater.
The fact you moved the thread here seems to suggest we could have a full, official mod, in a future..... may be envolving Region names changes too!

[Franciscus]

Nice work, Jasta: I have always had an admiration for those who not only report errors, but also provide solutions for fixing them

Absolutely . Kudos to JastaV !.
But do not forget that before JastaV, I and others have not only pointed to several NCP map errors in a dedicated thread, but even provided solutions (vide eg my "Portugal micro-mod" - not exactly one of the most popular mods, I wonder why ? ). Although at the time PhilThib gave positive feedback to eventually make "in-game" those corrections, nothing was done, that I am aware of. Mind you, I understand time constraints from AGEOD team, and other priorities. I am only afraid that the time for "in-game" corrections has passed, and that is unfortunate for NCP...

Nevertheless, the recent work by JastaV and Nikel (general portraits) give me some hope.

Regards

[jastaV]

Absolutely . Kudos to JastaV !.
But do not forget that before JastaV, I and others have not only pointed to several NCP map errors in a dedicated thread, but even provided solutions (vide eg my "Portugal micro-mod" - not exactly one of the most popular mods, I wonder why ? ). Although at the time PhilThib gave positive feedback to eventually make "in-game" those corrections, nothing was done, that I am aware of. Mind you, I understand time constraints from AGEOD team, and other priorities. I am only afraid that the time for "in-game" corrections has passed, and that is unfortunate for NCP...

Nevertheless, the recent work by JastaV and Nikel (general portraits) give me some hope.

Regards

Keep mind of the troublesome way official mods to map are managed:

http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?t=9950

&

http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?t=9958


Keep mind of AGEOD projects just released, (WIA), or work in progress, (VGN).

Hopefully a future NCP patch could fix most evident map mistakes: at least those influencing strategy and planning.......See, for example, major fortresses to be placed at river cross-points!!!!!

Guess we'll have to wait for NCP2 to see an overall map re-editing!

[Nikel]

I voted for the changes because I want to encourage you, as Franciscus


But in fact I have no idea if your changes are accurate or not. Since I started with the portraits I have not played at all leure: I only open the game to check if the portrait I am working on looks decent or not.


My main interest in that somebody expands the already available scenarios, is because this is one of problems of the game. Most people that has played NCP has played PW because it is a long campaign, but do you get the same fun with Waterloo campaign?

When I came here and later, I read the first posts about this game and everybody was very excited. When passed some time and after the release, it seemed that people was not so happy and a bit disappointed. The reason seems to be that NCP is compared with AACW, and the features that are important for this game to be considered so good, NCP is lacking them. The great campaign and the way you get the troops seem to be these essential aspects (perhaps there are more that I am missing)



So a key aspect , as aryaman said, is to expand or join the available scenarios. And as for this work are necessary the volunteers and there are not many of them, the game is stuck. The same can be said of the changes in the map. You will not find many Gray_Lensmans out there, with his will, knowledge and patience

[Rafiki]

Franciscus, for the record, if I commend someone for something, it should in no way be taken to mean that those I don't commend aren't commendable

Nevertheless, the recent work by JastaV and Nikel (general portraits) give me some hope.

Indeed; just take a look to AACW, where the modding activities of various people continually keep adding to and improving the game; I see no reason the same shouldn't be possible for NCP

[jastaV]

Guess I'll have to include map-structure changes here represented in a playable mod: 1813 historical French unit models mod with the recent map-structure mods could work fine to verify with hand how things work!

I'll do that in my next pause from Germany, April 1813 Scenery editing duties.

[jastaV]

...... I have no idea if your changes are accurate or not. Since I started with the portraits I have not played at all leure: I only open the game to check if the portrait I am working on looks decent or not.

Welcome to modders and 3rd party add-on community!
I lived all that, for the first time, when I enjoyed Il2-DCG years ago!

Il2-DCG is a 3rd party, freeware Dynamic Campaign Generator edited by Paul Lowengrin, while Il-2 series is a best-seller in combat fly simulation.

I was used to dedicate most of my time on PC gaming to Il-2: playing mission after mission. Things changed when I started supporting Paul Lowengrin as a beta tester, and campaign designer.......Time spent to actually play Il-2 dropped, while the overal time spent over Il-2 and Il2DCG on editing and testing duty increased! None the less, the historical research, the going after new editing solutions, the testing is........charming !!!!!!

P.S.: My last two weeks over NCP went mostly after editing and testing jobs too!
I played The Eagle's Return more times, and played twice The Struggle of Nations 1813, mod ver. 1.04. But, indeed I was playing with critical spirit just to verify things were running.......Nothing to see with enjoying pure PC gaming !

[Florent]

Nice to see Il2 fans here !!!
Nice work for the fortresses, nevertheless, Spandau is in Berlin area not an adjacent one, i ate in the restaurant in this Fortress in 1993 during my military service and the fortress is some minutes away from City centre taking transport.
I would also put Küstrin one area to the north, in NeuMark area.

[jastaV]

Nice to see Il2 fans here !!!
Nice work for the fortresses, nevertheless, Spandau is in Berlin area not an adjacent one, i ate in the restaurant in this Fortress in 1993 during my military service and the fortress is some minutes away from City centre taking transport.
I would also put Küstrin one area to the north, in NeuMark area.

I'll keep mind of your suggestions, anyway but the real topographic positions of fortresses, I took major care to NCP region & road network. So, I placed fortresses in position where actually they are controlling, by ZOC, any important route! Guess that was the reasons for building fortresses, and the way they should work within NCP!

[PhilThib]

Beware of not adding too many fortresses...the engine is already prone to making long sieges...which are (sieges I mean) not a major fact of the Napoleonic warfare era, characterized by speed of movement...the 1806 Prussian campaign is a telling example...

[Florent]

1813 is the special case in the Napoleonic warfare where fortresses fixed a great number of troops, first Russian, and later Landsturm and Landwehr.
In spring 1813 the russian had about 46-48000 men for Lützen out of 112000 men starting in January 1813.
This strategy of Napoléon to fill the fortresses was thus good in fixing troops.
But i agree that we should use only those who played an important role.
Although Dresden had the old city with walls, it falls easily in 1806 or 1813, it was more a supply source.

[jastaV]

1813 is the special case in the Napoleonic warfare where fortresses fixed a great number of troops, first Russian, and later Landsturm and Landwehr.
In spring 1813 the russian had about 46-48000 men for Lützen out of 112000 men starting in January 1813.
This strategy of Napoléon to fill the fortresses was thus good in fixing troops.
But i agree that we should use only those who played an important role.
Although Dresden had the old city with walls, it falls easily in 1806 or 1813, it was more a supply source.

I agree with Florent!
But that, 1813 Campaign was decided over a quite small operational theater: Saxony..... That although it was the campaign with the most numerous armies on the field!

[jastaV]

Down here two last stills from the modded map:

Berlin theater modded map


Berlin Theater default NCP map


Saxony theater modded map


Saxony Theater default NCP map


Guess nothing is changed in Berlin Theater area: the last suggestion to move Kustrin fortress in Neumark region has been......ignored!
That because there are not roads to control in Neumark.

In Saxony area I moved Erfurt to the west: it was too close to Leipzig, (expecially after Leipzig city has been moved in Halle region).
I also added Weimar in default Erfurt region.

These last changes are small improvement in relationship to previous version:
nothing is changed as regard the pool!

......In the evening I'll post the new 1813 Campaign mod, based over the last version of the map.......It also will introuduce some new changes!

[Gray_Lensman]

deleted

[jastaV]

This map work appears impressive. Is there any way you can post Before MOD: and After MOD: pictures of the same areas to compare the changes?

see the AACW "Historical Accuracy MOD thread for some examples: http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?t=6249 (Scroll down a few comments/posts)

I did this primarily by having 2 installations. One installation was always kept unchanged as the latest official updated version. The other installation was the one where the new changes were implemented. Then I took separate screen pics to post. This method really accentuates the changes for other gamers to look at and possibly make helpful suggestions.

Regards

Of course I can!
I just have to take pictures from default NCP Struggle of Nations - Germany, 1813 Campaign........A thing I'll do!!!!
Thanks for the suggestions!

[jastaV]

[SIZE="2"]The Struggle of Nations 1813: Historical Mod, [color="Red"]ver.2.06[/color][/size]

Now available for download!

http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?t=9917

The Struggle of Nations 1813: Historical Mod, ver.2.06 offers players the chance to experience the topographic changes here discussed.......and many, many more new issues!

[jastaV]

Pool closed with 100% in favour of modded map!
The quite simple modding strategy, based over structures shifting seems to be apreciated by community: indeed, but some graphic details, as region names, it's a very efficient way to change strategy-planning within a scenery.

[PhilThib]

Good work. Send me an email with all the assets needed for the mods to be implemented in the future. Thanks

And if you have time, you can have a look into the Polish map changes suggested by Morvael...

[jastaV]

Good work. Send me an email with all the assets needed for the mods to be implemented in the future. Thanks

Guess all files you need are with Germany 1813 Hist Mod:
http://www.ageod-forum.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3707&d=1218385149
Anyawy I'll send you files and comments related to the map modding specific issue, soon.

And if you have time, you can have a look into the Polish map changes suggested by Morvael.......

I already looked at that!
....there are possible changes to other areas too, to be considered!
BTW, I'm going after map mods only in relation of their strategical impact over sceneries I'm working over: see Ostende with The Eagle's return, and "Elbe Fortresses" with Germany 1813.
Unfortunately I plan to be busy over Germany for more times to come!