Industrialization (yet again)

[GraniteStater]

A copy and paste from my recently started AAR as a Union player:

Question - when should one stop investing in Industry? Under 1.16rc4a, the money from MD has disappeared, as far as I can tell, leaving NY as the only "money" state (LA is one also, once captured). In general, these are my thoughts on Industry:

* There is little to no incentive for the North to do more than LightIndy, as far as I can tell. Seem to get adequate returns with just Light.

* My 'usual' now is to LightIndy NY, PA, IL and MO. I used to do MD, but no reason to now, with rc4a.

* Believe it or not, I don't think I've ever voluntarily undone it. I just let it run. I'm sure quite a few here would demurr on this. If so, when do you stop? When the messages cease? When every town and city in the selected states have a factory icon?

[Mickey3D]

Question - when should one stop investing in Industry?

I don't know if something has changed with 1.16rc4a but with previous version I never industrialized when playing the north as there is far enough supply of all kinds.

[GraniteStater]

I don't know if something has changed with 1.16rc4a but with previous version I never industrialized when playing the north as there is far enough supply of all kinds.

I dunno, I seem to burn through $$ and WS pretty good. "More, more, more!" he cries.

Perhaps it's my experience with VH and now Colonel Difficulties. It's always something. If not $$ or WS, then warm bodies for the jaws of Moloch - and there is precious little one can do about men, except through Drafting, paying for Volunteers, or...Industrialization, if I'm reading the screens rightly. You do get so many conscripts extra in a state if you build there, ne c'est pas?

My previous Indy thread, many moons ago, was helpful, but still left me a-puzzled. The settings seem to show that LightIndy in three, four, or five selected states gives an adequate return. So, there is really no incentive to go beyond that. Puzzling, to my mind. To tell you the truth, I could be totally, awesomely wrong, but I have a sneaky feeling that the Investment is not supposed to be 'per-turn', but rather a one-time affair only. The latter would lend itself to a true incentive for a player to Invest in HvyIndy. Maybe every Renew Options period, or once a year, maybe, but something tells me Industrialization is not really WAD. Why do I say this? First, from my experience with the game and the fact that most posters here are 'meh' about the whole thing. CSA players are indifferent to it and would rather sail brigs out to sea, from what I read. Why? Why should this be? A CSA player looking to Change History would be just itchin' to industrialize, don'cha think? Maybe his trade-offs should be starker, but still...

Why have a game feature that is superfluous or nugatory? I'd love to have a copy of the project dox and design meeting minutes - I'd just bet, just bet, that something got lost in the shuffle.

[Mickey3D]

I your writing style

Perhaps it's my experience with VH and now Colonel Difficulties. It's always something. If not $$ or WS, then warm bodies for the jaws of Moloch - and there is precious little one can do about men, except through Drafting, paying for Volunteers, or...Industrialization, if I'm reading the screens rightly. You do get so many conscripts extra in a state if you build there, ne c'est pas?

$$ are mostly received through bonds and paper money printing. You'll receive also some each turn from the shipping box(USA)/blockade box(CSA) and from your cities.

Industrialization will increase only War Supply and General Supply production and the northern player has already plenty of them.

To increase the number of conscripts received each turn (aside of draft and call for volunteers) you have to take ennemy recruitement centers (the cities with a small tent) or send your officers with the recruiter special ability into big cities (size 5 and more, the bigger the better).

I have a sneaky feeling that the Investment is not supposed to be 'per-turn', but rather a one-time affair only

When you invest for industrialization, there is a chance (don't know the formula) to have new factory (WS or GS) appearing and this happen each turn as long as you keep the investment. I'm not sure but I think I read something a long time ago about a percentage increase if you keep your investement for several turns.

CSA players are indifferent to it and would rather sail brigs out to sea, from what I read. Why? Why should this be? A CSA player looking to Change History would be just itchin' to industrialize, don'cha think?

CSA player is facing a dilemna : industrialize (it costs $$ and WS) or use these resources to raise new troops. IMHO CSA should try to industrialize a little bit (at least in a PBEM) because its armies could starve beginning with 1864 if the north player manage to take key supply centers.

[GraniteStater]

Dear Sir,

You cannot make a professional scrivener happier than to let him know that you admire his style.

I will address other concerns later. Right now, I might get smugly drunk.

Thank you, very, very much.

[gchristie]

While reading AARs by Banks or Barksdale (or maybe both) I picked up the Union tip to invest in light industrialization in Missouri and Illinois to ensure that there are sufficient supplies for the troops in those fronts. Those areas are a bit barren compared to the East. Occasionally you get a boost to WS as well. While I agree with Mickey3D (after all who can disagree with a jolly snowman?) that globally there are lots of supplies for the North, they aren't always where one needs them and a bit of industrialization in the West works for me.

I tend to begin those investments at the start of the game and maintain them for about 6 months. My higher priorities are to invest in rail and river transport in order to move supplies generated and I try to max out the ocean transports and send them to the shipping box as soon as possible.

That is if my CSA opponent cooperates and doesn't upset my plans.

I don't think industrialization is unnecessary for the Union, it just isn't as high a priority as I thought it would be when I first started playing AACW many moons ago.

Regards.

[Cromagnonman]

If you're hurting for cash and war supply, industrialization is probably the first thing to cut. Industry requires an investment of money and WS each turn, and may return a combination of general supply, ammo, and war supply. However, I generally find the return to be rather small. For your cited shortfalls, I find sending transports to trade in the shipping box to be most effective. They seem to return 1-2 monies or war supply perturn depending on which you need more, so they return their investment within a year and the rest is profit.

Remember, when you buy industrialization on the economy screen, it shows you the cost. You don't find out what (if anything) you get until the next turn.

[Mickey3D]

If you're hurting for cash and war supply, industrialization is probably the first thing to cut

Remember, when you buy industrialization on the economy screen, it shows you the cost. You don't find out what (if anything) you get until the next turn.

True, but don't forget that industrialization is the only way of increasing your general supply production.

[Jim-NC]

Starving armies aren't any fun either. As the CSA player, you almost have to industrialize at some point, or watch your troops melt away due to hunger in the later stages of the game. That is also when you usually have the ability to do it (for me, WS becomes a non issue later in the game, I am always swimming in the things).

The general suupplies tend to collect in your supply depots, and you can really hurt yourself when you have to burn one or the enemy captures it. It can be 3-10 turns worth of supply production for the state it occupies. There is also such a supply differencial between Virginia and NC in the east, if you are forced to retreat (after you lose Richmond), then you are in for very lean times as you attempt to defend the rest of the south with your AOP/ANV survivors.

After the first 6 months, I try to keep at least 1 state with industrialization. I switch it around after I have reached a set point, and move on to the next state (for example, I attempt to get NC/SC/GA/AL/MS/LA to 100 GS per turn, then switch my target to 150 each).

[Ace]

If you lose Richmond than you are in big trouble, with or without industrialization.