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Major Tom
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Frontage Primer

Wed Feb 04, 2009 8:04 pm

EDIT: This was the original frontage post, which is now obsolete. Scroll down to Post #10 for Frontage Primer Ver. 2.0.
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Major Tom
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Wed Feb 04, 2009 9:18 pm

EDIT: Examples no longer valid, because artillery does not apply to Combat Units Quota.

I forgot to include a couple of simple examples I prepared --

EXAMPLE 1: Clear terrain – Clear weather
  • Combat Units Quota of 180.
  • Heavy infantry uses up 4 quota points per element.
  • Artillery uses 4 quota points per element.
  • Light horse uses 2 quota points per element
  • So, 180/4 = 45 heavy infantry or artillery elements can be engaged, or up to 180/2 = 90 light cavalry elements, or any mix of the three types that does not exceed the 180 Combat Units Quota, e.g., 20 cav + 20 inf + 15 arty; or 10 cav + 10 inf + 30 arty.

EXAMPLE 2: Hills – Frozen weather
  • Combat Units Quota of 130.
  • Heavy infantry uses up 12 quota points per element.
  • Artillery uses 16 quota points per element.
  • Light horse uses 10 quota points per element
  • So, 130/12 = 10 heavy infantry can be engaged, or up to 130/16 = 8 artillery, or 130/10 = 13 light cavalry, or any mix of the three types not exceeding the 130 quota, e.g., 3 cav + 5 inf + 2 arty; or 1 cav + 2 inf + 6 arty.


Also, in my sources I neglected to mention that the info on Combat Unit Quotas is taken from the AACW_DB_Terrains file which is linked to in this modding thread: http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?t=5358
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Wed Feb 04, 2009 9:54 pm

EDIT: Spreadsheet no longer current. See spreadsheet attached to Post #15.
For anyone who wants to dig deeper into the Combat Unit Quota, this spreadsheet might be useful.

I took the terrain database info and condensed just the relevant material onto a single tab, and added tables to compare the quota costs based on 1) % of Combat Unit Quota used by a single element, 2) relative effect of weather on each type, 3) quota cost of each type relative to Heavy Foot (useful to use line infantry as a baseline for comparison).

EDIT: I just relaized I uploaded the file with a couple of extra tabs with junk on them, and the good data is on tab C. I'm replacing with a cleaner copy.
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Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:31 am

Thank you Major Tom for spending the time typing this up. Frontage is still probably my single biggest concern in the game in regards to basic doctrine and strategy. I can make heaps of other mistakes but at least trying to have corps with competitive suites is essential.

"If not already engaged, the more hits it have, the bigger the chance to get committed." This line might explain why many battles start at a lower range than expected (less than the maximum of any artillery in the battle) because the arty weren't picked in the first round because they only have eight hits to the infantry's twenty?

Thanks again

BI

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Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:45 am

Wow, superb work!! From a time ago, I´ve been trying to totally understand the question of frontage, and, above all, their implications in in-game strategy. This is the definitive answer. Your my hero, Major!!! Thanks a lot

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Thu Feb 05, 2009 2:48 pm

Big Ideas wrote:"If not already engaged, the more hits it have, the bigger the chance to get committed." This line might explain why many battles start at a lower range than expected (less than the maximum of any artillery in the battle) because the arty weren't picked in the first round because they only have eight hits to the infantry's twenty?BI


You know, I think you may be right, and I misinterpreted this Pocus quote. I thought he was referring to the amount of combat damage (in "hits") a unit had taken, not the total number of "hits" that a unit has. So my comment about it maybe being a negative modifier instead of a positive one is probably off base.

I'd be interested to know a lot more about how elements are selected fo combat. You're right, infantry elements have more hits than artillery, so even in a stack with equal amounts of infantry and artillery, in clear terrain and clear weather where they have the same unit quota cost, it sounds you will get more infantry units committed than artillery, instead of a 50-50 split. If that's true, the only way to compensate for it and make sure your artillery gets into the fight is to have even MORE artillery. I'm not sure this makes sense.

Also, I don't think this will just affect the first round, but every round. The process is repeated for every round, so unless the slection modifiers change after round 1, you would not expect the mix of units to change until your infantry get used up -- either destroyed or routed.
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Thu Feb 05, 2009 3:01 pm

Sorry to keep bumping my own thread, but I just realized there's another major element to how units are selected for combat that hasn't been discussed at all: how different divisions in a corps stack get chosen for combat.

The basic frontage rules that I've tried to interpret and articulate do not cover this at all. They make it sound like all of the elements in a stack are considered outside of their units for inclusion in combat. So, any given element in a stack, regardless of which division it is in, could be picked by the game engine to join the combat.

But we all know from actual combat results that the main brunt of the damage in hits and cohesion is usually borne by one division, and sometimes one or more divisions may not take any damage at all, so they probably were not even engaged.

There's clearly another level of complexity in how this process works. It seems likely that there's another rule for deciding which unit or division in a stack will engage first, and then if that unit does not fill the Combat Units Quota, another unit or division can start adding elements, up to the quota limit, and so on until the quota is filled. This could leave some units or divisions fully engaged, some not engaged at all, and some only engaged with a few elements.

So then the question is, how is it decided which unit or division jumps into battle first? Is there a bonus based on leader stats? Unit cohesion? Discipline? Movement speed of the unit, or average movement speed of the elements in the unit (or total frontage requirement for the unit, which would be based on the same movement stat)?

So far I think this thread is still only scratching the surface of the issue. The most important question is not "how does frontage work" but "how does the game engine decide which units or elements to put into combat"?
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Thu Feb 05, 2009 5:59 pm

Does the type of element plays a role in this? If I have only one sharpshooter in a division with many infantry elements, does the sharpshooter have an increased chance of engaging relative to the line infantry? If it is not engaged, will the first fire ability still apply to the elements that do engage?

No change in probability, no bonus because none of your type (sharpshooter) is already committed, e.g. The only thing close to that is that when possible, we only add one supply element caught in the fight, if we can fill the support quota with others elements.
But the ability will apply anyway.

Artillery assigned at the stack level (not in a Division) supposedly will target the largest enemy unit. How does this rule fit with the frontage rules? Is this done outside of the regular frontage, so these units are “extra” or are they assigned randomly along with the other elements in the stack?

No extra here, but please be sure to understand there is a quota for line element and another separate pool for support elements. Big Ideas is misunderstanding that here:
This line might explain why many battles start at a lower range than expected (less than the maximum of any artillery in the battle) because the arty weren't picked in the first round because they only have eight hits to the infantry's twenty?

As the 2 quotas are separate, there is no competition between infantry and artillery to be selected.
Corps Support (a unit with only artillery) will fire on the healthiest unit of the stack it is opposed against, not the unit it is opposed against. And I meant health when talking about hits (not damage done, but you rectified later).
In AACW, there is a leader bonus of +25 per strategic rating point to Combat Unit Quota in clear terrain. In BoA there is also a bonus for leader rank and a bonus based on offense/defense rating. Do those bonuses apply in AACW?

You must read 'open' terrain here, and not 'clear' stricto senso. Open terrain is 'clear', 'prairie', 'wood', 'desert'.
The quota bonus in open terrain is either 25 pts per modified rating, for line elements, and 10 for supports.
The modified rating is either the offensive rating or the defensive rating (depending of the posture) time leader rank. Yes it means a lot in open terrain, you can really overwhelm the other if in number.

last, how units/elements get picked. A thing to know is that the elements involved within an unit will all fire against the same unit. Generally this enemy unit, if it has not chosen yet a target, will fire back. This can explain why some of your units get badly mauled while others don't have a scratch:

Your unit A1 fire against enemy unit B1, which is replying against A1. Your unit A2 (you have more units) can also attack B1, and will not get casualties (some simplification and abstraction here, you are flanking/attacking the rear, of the enemy).

Another side effect is that a small unit can be entirely destroyed by another powerful unit. This can be bad or good. Bad because you lose an entire unit, and the damages are not spread over many elements. Good because the big enemy unit will 'waste' some of its firepower killing your unit, and will not redirect fire against another target for the whole round.
Image


Hofstadter's Law: "It always takes longer than you expect, even when you take into account Hofstadter's law."

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Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:00 pm

Wow!

Thanks a lot for such a detailed answer, Pocus!

I have to go back to to the drawing board on this subject -- I didn't even mention the Support Units Quota or include it in my analysis spreadsheet.

Thanks, again, Pocus.
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Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:26 pm

FYI, for the artillery enthusiasts --

The best Support Units Quota is 60 (for normal terrain, cities, and forts).

The best Wheeled movement rate (i.e., quota cost for frontage) is 4.

So, under the best conditions of terrain and weather, no more than 60/4 = 15 artillery elements can engage in a single round. Subtract 1 if there is a supply wagon present.

I'm going to rework my frontage analysis and post it later today or tomorrow.
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Excellent work

Thu Feb 05, 2009 8:38 pm

What a superb thread! :)

"Frontage" I believe is the mysterious issue. I'd intended to whip out the analytical toolset on the topic after "finishing" artillery; but it doesn't look like I'll need to. Someone's already done it... and done it much better than I might have!

Major Tom, this is an excellent effort: Excellent concept, excellent analysis, excellent timing, and excellent presentation. Thank you! :thumbsup:

I've added this thread to the "Basic Training" series for newcomers.
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Thu Feb 05, 2009 9:17 pm

Thanks for the kind words, Dixicrat. I've gotten so much great info out of this forum from you and others that I'm very happy to be able to give back to the community.

It seems like my biggest goof was not realizing that artillery is considered a support unit! I should have suspected that's why there was a separate "Support Units Quota" in the database. I just ignored it bacause I thought "Who cares how many wagons and engineers you can put into a fight? It's like worrying about how many cheerleaders are at a football game."
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Thu Feb 05, 2009 9:49 pm

Excellent research Major Tom


....and btw the following quote made my day.
Major Tom wrote:"Who cares how many wagons and engineers you can put into a fight? It's like worrying about how many cheerleaders are at a football game."
"In times of war, the Devil makes more room in Hell."

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Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:00 pm

Just to whet the appetite of you artillerists (I mean you, Dixicrat :D )

Here's what you get when you divide the Support Units Quota by the Wheeled movement rates.

Image

This shows the maximum number of support elements, including artillery, that can join the combat. In any kind of rough terrain or weather, artillery is severely limited. Obviously, you don't drag your artillery up a mountainside in a blizzard!

I'll inlclude this in the revised frontage analysis spreadsheet I'll post soon.
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Frontage Primer

Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:48 am

[SIZE="4"]AACW Frontage Primer[/size]
Ver 2.0
By Major Tom

In military terminology, "frontage" is defined as the space a unit takes up along a line of battle, but in the context of AACW it's used to refer to the limitation on the number of units that can be deployed on the battlefield.

Depending on the terrain and weather conditions, an army is limited in the number of troops that can be engaged. Units that move slowly will also maneuver slowly and so cannot be as readily deployed. Troops that are not engaged are held in reserve and can be sent in to relieve broken units. The game engine handles all of these details invisibly during combat resolution, but it's important to know how the system works so that you can adjust your tactics accordingly.

Combat Units Quota
  • For each terrain type, there is a Combat Units Quota and a separate Support Units Quota which limits the number of combat and support elements on each side that can engage in combat during a single combat round (the quota covers all units participating in the combat, not separately computed for each division or stack).
  • The quotas are unaffected by weather, except in the case of cities and forts, where for some reason they are somewhat reduced in clear weather.
  • Important: for purposes of frontage, artillery is considered a support unit, so it fills up the Support Units Quota.
Quota Costs
  • Each type of element will use up a set amount of the Combat Units Quota (or Support Units Quota) for each element added to the combat.
  • This amount is affected by weather, with harsh weather generally increasing the amount of the quota that an element will use, thereby reducing the number of elements that can engage in combat.
  • The quota cost for each type of element is taken from the base unmodified movement cost for the specific type of element in the specific type of terrain. (e.g., cavalry are especially slow in mud, so fewer of them can be deployed).
Assigning to Combat
  • The game engine will randomly assign elements to be engaged in combat until the Combat Unit Cost Quota and the Support Unit Cost Quota are both filled. This process is repeated for each combat round.
  • The chance of a particular element being engaged is modified by:
    [INDENT]
  • Whether the unit is already engaged (big increase in chance to be engaged again).
  • If not already engaged, the number of hits (i.e., health) an element has (e.g., militia have lower total hits than line infantry so are less likely to be engaged).
  • If routed, chance to be picked is reduced.
  • There is no precedence advantage for different types of elements, and no bonus if you have just one of something (like a sharpshooter), but the element’s special ability will still apply to its unit even if not engaged (first fire for sharpshooter).
  • If supply wagons are present, the game engine will not assign more than one supply element to combat as long as there are other types of support elements (e.g., artillery) available to fill the Support Units Quota.
    [/INDENT]
Modifiers
A few specific terrain/weather combinations subtract -25% from the quotas for units in offensive posture only (so the attacker can employ fewer elements than the defender):
  • Wilderness/Hills/Mtn/Swamp/Marsh in Mud or Blizzard weather.
  • Fort and City in all weather.
In open terrain only (clear/prairie/desert/wood), the Units Quotas are modified by leader (rank)*(offensive/defensive rating) depending whether in offensive or defensive posture:
  • Combat Units Quota: (+25 points)*(rank)*(off/def rating)
  • Support Units Quota: (+10 points)*(rank)*(off/def rating)
This bonus can be HUGE. A mediocre 1* general with 1 off/def would get a +25 bonus, while a 2* general with a 3 off/def would get a +150 bonus (+60 for support units), so he could bring about 60% more infantry elements to the fight, and twice as much artillery!

Other Notes
  • Elements from the same unit will all fire against the same enemy unit. If they have overwhelming firepower and destroy the enemy unit outright, the excess firepower for the round is “wasted” and not redirected at another enemy unit.
  • With multiple divisions engaged, you may only see casualties in one because the enemy’s fire was all directed at the same unit.
  • Corps support artillery (unassigned to divisions) will fire on the healthiest (i.e., strongest) enemy unit. This may not be the same unit that it is directly opposed against.
QUESTIONS:
Still unclear on how elements are assigned if there are multiple units in the stack (separate divisions or brigades). Pocus has not given any indication that units are engaged together, except in his comment about units firing on the same target. It may simply be that if you bring three divisions to a fight and there’s limited frontage, all three might be partially engaged.

Also, on the leader bonus, I’m assuming it must be the stack leader, not the unit leader, because there can only be one unit quota for a battle, so the modifier can only come from one leader. But what about battles with multiple stacks? Does the leader bonus come from the first stack to engage? From the best leader? From the highest ranking?

Notes on Terrain/Weather/Unit Type Combinations
There are literally hundreds of different combinations of terrain/weather/unit type. Here are some general comments:
  • Cavalry have a big frontage advantage over infantry in clear/city/fort terrain + clear weather, but not in any other conditions, and they especially don’t like mud.
  • Forts and cities have the lowest quotas (Forts are somewhat better) and they also impose a -25% quota penalty on the attacker.
  • Light infantry have the lowest all around frontage cost, especially in rough terrain and harsh weather.
The Data
My frontage analysis data are in the attached Excel file, but all of the data came from the AACW_DB_Terrains file which is linked to in this modding thread: http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?t=5358
EDIT: I've hidden some unit movement types that I thought were not used, but was wrong about MedFoot. To see that, you'll need to unhide the rows.

The unit types displayed in the data file are:
  • Ranger
  • LitFoot
  • MedFoot
  • HvyFoot
  • LitHorse
  • MedHorse
  • HvyHorse
  • Wheeled
Each of these unit types has a different movement cost for moving into each terrain type, modified by the weather. In AACW, the unit type for movement purposes is shown in the element details window under Movement (not the same as the unit type listed in the upper portion of the window, or the unit type after that in parentheses – yes, it’s confusing that a single element can have three different unit types!). The unit types listed above, that are used in the database, don’t exactly match what you see in the element details window.
EDIT: for the most part, infantry in AACW are all HvyFoot. Partisans are LitFoot, but light infantry, volunteers, skirmishers, and militia are all MedFoot. Almost all cavalry is MedHorse (rangers and raiders are LitHorse).

Strategy Notes - General
  • Don’t underestimate the importance of the leader bonus for frontage. If you have a stack with a very strong leader, try to engage the enemy in open terrain, and feel free to pack in extra artillery, because the frontage bonus means you can put more of them onto the battlefield in open terrain. On the flip side, if you have a weak leader, stick to rough terrain if possible to minimize your opponent’s leadership advantage.
  • Cavalry have 2:1 frontage advantage over infantry in clear terrain, but it doesn't seem very useful -- cavalry actions are usually small, and the frontage quota in clear terrain is so high that you could never fill it with cavalry unless you find a way to make 5 full cavalry divisions and stack them together.
  • For cavalry raider divisions, keep in mind that horse artillery are support units, so they don’t detract from the number of cavalry elements you can field. So even in rough terrain, some horse artillery will add a lot to your firepower. Horse artillery…don’t leave home without it.
  • In general, a smaller force should always try defend to against a larger force in rough terrain, and a larger force should use caution advancing through the mountains.
  • Remember that the frontage limitations are only per round. Battles occur in multiple rounds, and in each round different units can cycle in and out. So, even if your force is too large for the allowed unit quota, it’s still an advantage to have a larger force because your fresh units can relieve your damaged ones. Ultimately a much weaker force will succumb. Yes, the vastly outnumbered Greeks held off the Persians at Thermopylae…but only for awhile.
Strategy Notes - Artillery
  • Because Artillery fills up the Support Units Quota, they won’t compete with infantry for engagement slots. But, they will compete with other support units. This shouldn’t be a big deal, since supply wagons will only put in one element, but if you also have engineers, signal, and recon units, it could all add up to a reduced number of artillery elements on the field.
  • The maximum number of artillery elements in combat is 15 in open terrain (or city/fort) and clear weather. But in any other kind of weather or terrain, artillery is severely reduced (from just 2 elements in mtn/blizzard to 10 in wood/clear, but averaging about 6 across all terrain/weather combinations). This number can be reduced by supply or other support units taking up Support Units Quota points, or increased by the leader bonus.
  • Most importantly, leader ability can drastically increase the number of artillery units you can use in open terrain (clear/prairie/desert/wood). An average leader will raise the maximum in open terrain and clear weather to 17. A strong 2* leader can raise it to 30, and a super leader to 45 or more. Basically, a good leader can double your artillery frontage, and a great one can triple it (but only in open terrain).
  • Frontage rules put a practical limit on how many artillery elements to put into a stack (or division). But how many is ideal? It depends on the size of the stack – whether it’s a solo division or smaller independent force, or a large multi-division stack like a big corps. With any more than 6 artillery in a stack, you are likely to have some idle artillery units that will not engage. On the other hand, in a big stack, if you have 15 artillery you know you are always bringing maximum firepower to bear.
  • My recommendations: 4 artillery per division in a large corps (less if you assign artillery at the corps level). Up to 6 or 7 in an independent division. More in a static defensive position in open terrain, fort, or city. If you have a strong stack commander, increase the amount of artillery and try to stick to clear terrain, but don’t overdo it – in anything but clear terrain your excess artillery is dead weight. Having too much artillery is not a bad thing, except for the cost of producing it and the CP cost of having it in your stack.
  • Consider using massed artillery in an Army HQ stack, along with an extra general with the artillerist ability (like Huger for the CSA). Imagine Lee with a super army HQ stack packed with 20+ artillery, in clear terrain, marching to the sound of the guns to support Jackson’s corps. All 20 of those guns will target the largest enemy unit, possibly obliterating it in a singe round! Just don’t let the artillery army HQ stack get caught on its own – better to keep it in the same region as a subordinate corps for protection, since the larger corps stack would be targeted by the enemy in combat. This strategy sounds viable in the game, and it also seems historically appropriate.
  • Forts and cities have the same high frontage allowance as clear terrain, but no leader bonus. As it is, the frontage allowance is more than enough to allow you to pack large quantities of artillery into your forts and cities. I wonder how many ships would get by Island 10 with a dozen or more 20# Parrott batteries?

Tables
I’m not going to post all of the tables in this thread, because I’m providing the spreadsheet for download (see bottom of post). But to facilitate discussion, I’ll post the basic table on clear terrain and my analysis tables on support units (i.e., artillery).

Please feel agree to disagree with any of my strategy notes, or add more – I’m better at crunching the numbers than seeing all of the implications.

Image

Image


[SIZE="3"]Sources:[/size]

Pocus quote from a BoA thread (the details will differ but the same principles should apply to AACW): http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?t=1024

“Before starting an hour of battle, the BE will pick a subset of your unit to actually fight. Why a subset? Because you can’t really expect to have 70,000 men actually fighting on a beach if you land or assaulting a fort at the same time or even firing all at once in a dense forest. This is where the Terrain Contingencies kick in!

Some examples:

Nine regiments of regulars can fight at the same time in clear terrain. Add to that a bonus for each point the Commander of the army has (either in offensive or in defensive, depending on the posture chosen) and another bonus based on the rank he has (so a 3 stars leader can always field a good amount of regiments in plains, even if he won't use clever tactics!). The 2 leader bonuses only apply on clear terrain.

The other terrain are simpler to deal with: there is only a TC amount to consider. Take wilderness for example: 3 regiments of regulars will fight at a given time there (the elements will be rotated after each hour of battle, so you can wear off the enemy), but 10+ Indians tribes/rangers/partisans can be engaged (that's theoretical, you will have a problem finding this number of units in your OOB, but it's to show that you can inflict very serious losses against an enemy in superior numbers, depending of the terrain).

If a unit is appropriate for to a terrain, only a few terrain contingency points will be used, so you can pile on more of them, or have some more room for costlier units (e.g. 3 Indians tribes + 2 militias).

Just use common sense, and it will work: dense terrain are not fit for regular units, but are the realms of lighter ones. A fort can't be assaulted by too many men at a given time, etc.”


Pocus posts in Napoleon’s Campaigns forum: http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?t=6617

“Some global variables have also been much reduced, for example in AACW you get a +25 bonus per strat rating to frontage if in clear terrain. In NCP this is just only 5 (by request of the Historical Team).”

“Each element has a cost to be deployed on a terrain, given a certain weather (this cost IS his travel time in day by the way).

On the other side, you have an overall quota in lines or supports.

So when the battle happens, the engine will pick one element, pay the cost in frontage, and add it to the battleground. Rinse and repeat until no element can be added.”

“If not already engaged, the more hits it have, the bigger the chance to get committed. If already engaged, the probability to be taken again the next round is much higher. If routed, the probability is lower.”


Pocus on how movement cost is used for a unit type’s frontage cost: http://www.ageod-forum.com/showthread.php?t=11074

“Good question, I had to check the code. This is the 'base day cost' used, drawn from the terrain matrix, and it does not take into account the road network, or the added cost for being under commanded etc.”

“No, MR is not taken into account here. Frontage cost is deduced from the base days needed to travel into a region, because, for a given unit, 95% of the time you see a very strong correlation between how it is easy for her to move into a region and how easy it is to use or deploy the said unit. For example irregulars in wood, artillery in swamps, etc.”
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Fri Feb 06, 2009 7:01 am

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Major Tom
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Fri Feb 06, 2009 7:07 am

Yeah, I know, but then a thread can get weird, showing responses to posts that no longer exist. Like, if you come along later and delete your post, this post makes me look like a crazy dude talking to himself (not too far from the truth). Makes it hard for someone just coming into the thread to figure it out. Plus, by just appending a note, I can leave my stupid mistakes on display for historical reference.

But...I did just go in and delete my earlier post with the obsolete spreadsheet download so no one will get the wrong file, and a few other redundant posts that aren't referenced in later posts. Happy? :neener:

Oh no! My post count just went down by 5!
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Fri Feb 06, 2009 8:09 am

Major Tom wrote:
Also, on the leader bonus, I’m assuming it must be the stack leader, not the unit leader, because there can only be one unit quota for a battle, so the modifier can only come from one leader. But what about battles with multiple stacks? Does the leader bonus come from the first stack to engage? From the best leader? From the highest ranking?



First of all, thanks for the excellent work Major Tom.

I guess modifier comes from the highest ranking officer in a certain region (although it still needs comfirmation). One thing to confirm that is to check the battle log. Once i have some time, that'll be the first thing i'll do.

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Fri Feb 06, 2009 2:55 pm

Evren wrote:First of all, thanks for the excellent work Major Tom.

I guess modifier comes from the highest ranking officer in a certain region (although it still needs comfirmation). One thing to confirm that is to check the battle log. Once i have some time, that'll be the first thing i'll do.


Yes, you must be right. It would be the same commanding general whose picture appears in the battle results screen, and it seems that is always the most senior ranking general.
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Major Tom
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Fri Feb 06, 2009 8:58 pm

Major Tom wrote:it looks to me like LitFoot is probably just used for skirmishers, sharpshooters, partisans, and some militia. Regular line infantry and some militia are HvyFoot. Most cavalry are MedHorse, but a few (like Texas Rangers) are LitHorse. And of course all artillery and wagons are wheeled, as are engineers and perhaps other support units as well. As far as I can tell, Ranger, MedFoot, and HvyHorse are not used in AACW, so I’ve hidden those rows in my analysis spreadsheet. It may be that partisans use the Ranger movement type, but that varies only slightly from LitFoot.


Looking at the AACW_DB_Models44h file, I can see that I was wrong about the movement types for a lot of units. Most of the units I thought would use the LitFoot type are actually using the MedFoot movement type. In my spreadsheet, I've hidden the rows with MedFoot, so if you want to see them you'll have to unhide them. MedFoot is only slightly different from HvyFoot - so my comment about light infantry being good for frontage is also wrong, since they are actually MedFoot. I was right that the Ranger and HvyHorse movement types are not used.

According to the database, all infantry units are HvyFoot and all cavalry are MedHorse except:

LitFoot
  • Bushwhackers
  • Partisans
  • Guerillas
  • Unionists
MedFoot
  • Light Infantry
  • Pioneers
  • Sharpshooters
  • Skirmishers
  • Volunteers
  • Militia
LitHorse
  • Bushwhackers (the mounted variety)
  • Raiders
  • Rangers


Also, all of the support units use wheeled movement except Pioneers (MedFoot) and Horse Artillery (MedHorse). Note: marines, sailors, and sharpshooters are not support units.
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Major Tom
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Fri Feb 13, 2009 12:23 am

Frontage article posted to Wiki.

It's not pretty, but it's there. My first attempt at a Wiki page. I know, I'm a caveman :wacko:
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soundoff
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Fri Feb 13, 2009 1:33 am

Really really excellent Major Tom....not to my liking as my interest is in strategy not whats going on under the bonnet..but as I said in another thread....I'd have you on my staff anytime. Superb work. You and Dixiecrat (with his work on Artillery) would make a formidable combination. :thumbsup:

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Chuske
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Sun Mar 03, 2013 6:05 pm

Wanting to clarify that frontage applies to all units taking part in the battle ie all corps, divs and army stack (if present)?

If so has anyone found out since Majors Tom post if it is just the highest ranking leader who adds the bonus? ie If an army stack is present is it just the army commander who can give frontage bonus or do the corps and div commanders add to the bonus?

Final question is if I add artillery to the army stack is there any advantage or disadvantage to putting army stack artillery in a div maybe under a leadr with art bonus abilities?
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"If I had my choice I would kill every reporter in the world, but I am sure we would be getting reports from Hell before breakfast."
William Tecumseh Sherman

VigaBrand
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Thu May 02, 2013 8:57 am

In open terrain only (clear/prairie/desert/wood), the Units Quotas are modified by leader (rank)*(offensive/defensive rating) depending whether in offensive or defensive posture:

Combat Units Quota: (+25 points)*(rank)[color="#800000"]*[/color](off/def rating)
Support Units Quota: (+10 points)*(rank)[color="#800000"]*[/color](off/def rating)

Is that multiplication right?
I see in the AJE Thread from Narwahl, that in AJE it is a plu
In open terrain only (clear/prairie/desert/wood), the Units Quotas are modified by leader (rank)*(offensive/defensive rating) depending whether in offensive or defensive posture:

Combat Units Quota: (+25 points)*((rank)+[color="#800000"][/color](off/def rating))
Support Units Quota: (+10 points)*((rank)[color="#800000"][/color](off/def rating))
The difference is huge, so that is the question why I ask.
Did anybody know that?

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Ace
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Thu May 02, 2013 9:30 am

Only the developers can answer with 100% accuracy. What I can tell you is that in AACW, when in open terrain, with a good leader all my units would always be engaged. In AJE, that would not be the case.
The two eras, combat-wise are un-comparable, and hence the difference.

VigaBrand
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Location: Berlin, Germany

Thu May 02, 2013 11:42 am

Where can you see which elements are involved? I don't see a round analysise like in later games (RoP, AJE).

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Captain_Orso
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Thu May 02, 2013 12:22 pm

Don't go there!! You're too young for doing that to yourself!! Image Image

Go into setting and under System put a checkmark on "Log Errors".

Run a turn with a battle in it and then look in the "Logs" directory. There you should find a file named !battlereport.txt or .log don't know anymore.

When your eyes begin to bleed, don't say I didn't worn you :blink:

Somewhere in the forum you can find a Battle-Report app that supposedly makes the battle reports easier to read
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Ace
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Thu May 02, 2013 3:24 pm

VigaBrand wrote:Where can you see which elements are involved? I don't see a round analysise like in later games (RoP, AJE).


if you are not a masochist like some of us, you can simply see which elements lost some cohesion after the battle. Those are the ones which did the fighting.

VigaBrand
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Location: Berlin, Germany

Thu May 02, 2013 4:07 pm

Yes, but that doesn't help, because if you fight more than one round, it should be, that in the second round will be other troops fight than in the first round. So it doesn't help for knowing about the frontage.

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