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I DL'ed the demo... But I'm undecided. Seems to me its 99% HOI2 and I'm a bit bored of HOI. Too much micromanaging to start with...

As anybody tried the demo? How it is?

Too much micromanagement???

There is too little micromangement in HOI2!!! Now I haven't played HOI2DD but I will buy it becuase of the expanded diplomacy options and the intelligence/subversion option. This makes the game much more realistic and you get more options to hit your enemy in a soft spot.

Yes Im a micromanagement fanatic...I know

If even Pocus find there's too much mm .. Personnally I never was able to play more than a couple game-days in HoI/HoI2, it seems to me like an awful mess with everything going on simultaneously, then I can't play correctly, then I get upset, and I quit.
It's not a game system suited to my tastes ... Can't even imagine how one can think there's *not enough* mm, even a SE4 or Stars! player (that I did play though!)

Well there is 2 differing aspects that is starting to bear on me with the HOI serie (and believe me, I played quite much all Paradox games):

a) the game is a monstruosity, and not enough time has been put in the AI. This means that in solo I'm always disappointed halfway in my game.

b) in multiplayers (I have tried that too), the micromanaging is hell on earth, even at slow speed. Last time I felt like I was playing a RTS (I was the russians), and frankly having to survey as I can my divisions is not my idea of a wargame, I want to make well thoughts decisions, not hurried ones.

So for now, no more HOI. I'm on strategic Command II now (I have the privilege to have the full version ).

I never found that Stars! was so demanding with Micro management (compare to Dominion at least).

The interface was ugly but wery well done, everything was thought to help the player in managing its empire.

The only part I found to be painfull was the design of my race, there you had to be really good at maths, and a poorly designed race could really ruin your game... (Dom was less demanding IMHO).

The A.I is a lot better in Doomsday and the intel is a nice minigame,it also fixes many issues like silly sub stacks of doom.

I also have SC2 and it is good game,nice for players who want to finish a WW2 strategy game after one nights play.The A.I in SC2 has not impressed me at all.Considering how simple SC2 is,Doomsday A.I is much better.

I've been a staunch fan of Paradox ever since EU2 (I even own Two Thrones and Crown of the North), but somehow, HOI2, unlike HoI1, never got to me, though I would not agree that there is too much MM involved (Victoria, OTOH, IS a Hell of tedious and unrealistic Micromanagement). Somehow, it's not that faszinating anymore, it feels to "clinical" and without heart.

Nevertheless, I bought Doomsday, too, and found it to be even worse than HoI2. The Doomsday scenario itself appears to be not well thought out and, again, designed without putting much heart into it. Starting in September 1945 with hot war between the Sowjets and the Allies already broken out, I'm sorrowly missing a pre-war phase of growing tension from 1945 to, say 48/49. It just looks like they didn't put much effort into it other than writing some OoB, slightly expanding the tech trees for post 1947 techs and putting in a few new units like light Carriers.

And, as with all Paradox releases, it was buggy as hell and remains buggy even after the 1.01 patch. The leader experience system is broken, Air leaders commanding bombers never gain any experience, in ground battles with various leaders involved on one side, only ONE leader (the highest ranking) will ever gain experience at all. There are no namelists for Light carriers, for any nation. And, as far as the much praised brand new feature "espionage" is concerned, the AI is gaining ridicoulous bonuses, rendering counter espionage for the human player totally useless.

All in all, I didn't expect much from Doomsday, and yet, it still managed to disappoint me. (Don't ask, why I bought it at all, it's a paradox-fanboi thing ).

P.S. @ PDF: The problem of being overwhelmed by too much information to react to in too few time while playing Paradox-Games can be solved quite easily by setting all relevant message type settings to "display and pause", making the game "kind of" turn-based...

Henry D
Thanks for the tip, but pausing on every event of any magnitude was what I did in the EU series, quite happily ... But when I used that on HoI I had an unplayably snail-paced turn-based game with turns of .. 15 minutes !
Honestly there's something broken in the concept, you can't manage armies "on minute" and strategy at several years'horizon in the same framework.
With EU or CK it worked because the minimum time unit is 1 day, in HoI where it is 1 hour it can't for me (never tried Vicky..).

[quote="Pocus"]Well there is 2 differing aspects that is starting to bear on me with the HOI serie (and believe me, I played quite much all Paradox games):

a) the game is a monstruosity, and not enough time has been put in the AI. This means that in solo I'm always disappointed halfway in my game.

b) in multiplayers (I have tried that too), the micromanaging is hell on earth, even at slow speed. Last time I felt like I was playing a RTS (I was the russians), and frankly having to survey as I can my divisions is not my idea of a wargame, I want to make well thoughts decisions, not hurried ones.

So for now, no more HOI. I'm on strategic Command II now (I have the privilege to have the full version ]

Yep. You hit the nail on the head. HOI2 is a brilliant game but the AI is unplayably weak and playing such a complex game in real time against an opponent is a micromanagement nightmare. And as you said, there is no time for deep strategic thought, only constant management.

So it becomes a great game that is no fun to play!