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marek1978
Lieutenant Colonel
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Location: Warsaw, Poland

quality of units concern

Sat Feb 03, 2018 9:57 pm

I love this game.
Yet there is number of thing that give me concern.

One is that infrantry units acros the game have the same basic characteristic.
Infrantry company of dutch, british, austrian, polish, danish, swedish infrantry has always the same stats.

I know that devs team showed difrences in quality of different armies by giving them different experience.
But i would say that there was a huge gap beetwen english infrantry and french , and even bigger beetwen dutch and polish.

I really like very old concept from Europa Universalis were to improve quality of your army you had to spend money and time on bring new weapns and trainings.

I wonder if the system will be able to reporduce it in the future

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PhilThib
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Location: Meylan (France)

Re: quality of units concern

Sun Feb 04, 2018 2:35 pm

You could easily already make some differences between the nations by tweaking their individual models values (at the moment most default to the standard template)...no need to wait.

The real issue is to NOT introduce unbalanced values

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Nikel
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Re: quality of units concern

Sun Feb 04, 2018 4:34 pm

Pity it was not done and tested in beta stage! :crying:

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PhilThib
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Re: quality of units concern

Mon Feb 05, 2018 8:32 am

Nikel wrote:Pity it was not done and tested in beta stage! :crying:


The Beta did not find it justified, the point can be debatable :siffle:

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Nikel
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Re: quality of units concern

Tue Feb 06, 2018 11:20 am

Let's see whether somebody with knowledge and interest step in :pouet:

vaalen
AGEod Guard of Honor
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Re: quality of units concern

Thu Feb 15, 2018 3:31 am

There were very dignificant differences between the tactics used by some of the major nations.

For example, the Swedes relied mainly on melee combat, and their fierce charges helped win many victories. The Russians relied mainly on firepower. French combat formations were denser and more vulnerable to fire than the thinner British and Dutch formations. And many others.

Swedish and English cavalry charged home with the sword, while the other nations did not.

I think it is crucial to show these differences in the game, but there is an alternative to changing all the values.
IN wars of Napoleon, there was an excellent modifier system which made the forces of each major nation unique, with a number of simple modifiers that recreated the tactical differences between the various nations.

I suggest that such a system be implemented, if it is not already in the game.

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PhilThib
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Location: Meylan (France)

Re: quality of units concern

Thu Feb 15, 2018 8:57 am

vaalen wrote:I think it is crucial to show these differences in the game, but there is an alternative to changing all the values.
IN wars of Napoleon, there was an excellent modifier system which made the forces of each major nation unique, with a number of simple modifiers that recreated the tactical differences between the various nations.

I suggest that such a system be implemented, if it is not already in the game.


Implementing that system is a huge amount of work, and only presents interest IF the elements they modify changes over time. If the differences you present are permanent, its easier, faster and safer to alter the models values directly and permanently :indien:

vaalen
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Re: quality of units concern

Thu Feb 15, 2018 10:51 pm

PhilThib wrote:
vaalen wrote:I think it is crucial to show these differences in the game, but there is an alternative to changing all the values.
IN wars of Napoleon, there was an excellent modifier system which made the forces of each major nation unique, with a number of simple modifiers that recreated the tactical differences between the various nations.

I suggest that such a system be implemented, if it is not already in the game.


Implementing that system is a huge amount of work, and only presents interest IF the elements they modify changes over time. If the differences you present are permanent, its easier, faster and safer to alter the models values directly and permanently :indien:


I did not realize that. It worked beautifully in Wars of Napoleon. But I have no idea of what is difficult to do, so I withdraw the suggestion.

I do have an alternative. In this period, many of the units of different nations were quite similar to each other. But there were some crucial exceptions. so I propose that on ly the follownig units be modified.

British and Swedish cavalry should have higer ratings for melee than everyone else, as they were trained for it and very effective at charging home with the sword,

British and Dutch infantry should have a higher rate of fire, and do more damage, as they used a platoon system of fire that was very effective, and used thinner lines that enabled a larger portion of the men to fire. They should have high morale, as they were steadfast and rarely broke.

Swedish infantry should have very high melee and shock ratings, as they were trained to use melee attacks whenever possible, even when they had a smaller force. They also should have high morale, as they rarely broke.

Just my ideas. :)

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PhilThib
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Re: quality of units concern

Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:54 am

Will pass the suggestion then. May be you can start looking at the current values (seen enclosed file) and make suggestions...

My 2 cents would be to lower the base template values of Assault and TQ (which are a bit too high, and keep them for those 'better' infantries) and play around with other values.

Cheers
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