MrLongleg
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What factors make the Serbians so much more effective than the Austrians

Mon Sep 01, 2014 4:37 am

This is a question for the insiders - why do the Austrians always have such high casualties when fighting against Serbia, even when the Serbian units fight in open terrain without entrenchment on Austrian territory? Which factors make the difference?

Thanks for any insights, that ,might help me to understand the game engine better...

Reiryc
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Mon Sep 01, 2014 4:42 am

There are several factors that could come into play, but most likely it's leadership.

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Ace
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Mon Sep 01, 2014 5:54 am

And experience.

Respenus
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Mon Sep 01, 2014 10:02 am

When playing the CP, I usually keep the Austrians in a defensive position and do not advance much into Serbia. This sounds a bit gamey, but it is better to wait for the Bulgarians to join you in the war, than waste tens of thousands of men over useless territory.

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Shri
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Mon Sep 01, 2014 4:42 pm

Respenus, i too follow a strategy similar to you; but i do one thing-

I make a combination of all my armies and corps near Belgrade and then take out Belgrade and then send most of my armies to hunt the Serbian Deep raiders till Bulgaria comes in.

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Shri
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Mon Sep 01, 2014 4:45 pm

BTW_
If you are speaking Historically,

Serbians had won- Balkan War I & II just a couple of years before WW1, Austria had last fought in 1866 and lost.
Serbian Generals were very good esp. the ailing Putnik, there was considerable debate in Austria in July whether to allow Putnik to leave his hospital bed (he was in an Austrian Hospital) or not?

Maybe an event must be there for Austria in July- If you leave Putnik, get +1/+2 NM due to chivalry
or lose 1/2 NM and arrest Putnik but ends in Serbia losing Putnik.

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le Anders
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Mon Sep 01, 2014 5:09 pm

The Austrians are crap against the Russians as well. It's probably due to the quality of the troops.

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Shri
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Mon Sep 01, 2014 5:15 pm

Not exactly true, if you build a few units of medium artillery and then send those troops against the Russians, they end up winning.
Key to winning is to see that enough artillery and ammo and supply there for the armies.
Of course, in real life- Austrian armies were crap.

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Carnium
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Mon Sep 01, 2014 7:34 pm

Shri wrote:Of course, in real life- Austrian armies were crap.

Only when attacking foreign lands. They did fantastic job at keeping Italians at bay, because they were defending their own territory. Slavic nations didn't "love" being in Austria-Hungary, but the prospect of being a part of Italy was even worse.
This game could simulate this, but giving A-H Slavic troops a penalty when being outside their home territory.

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Kensai
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Mon Sep 01, 2014 8:08 pm

If you play the historical warplan for A-H, remember to move* von Hötzendorf (K.u.K. Armee) from Budapest after two months (when he unlocks) and move him to Novi Sad (or somewhere close) in order to activate the 5th and 6th Armies. This is important to double the CP and let the respective Generals get the C-in-C's attributes**. Moreover, remember that the Austrian-Hungarian GHQ can either be in the Balkan Front or the Eastern Front, not both. If you plan to defend vigorously against the Russians you need to move it in the Eastern Front Theater so it is near the 1st, 3rd, and 4th Armies. If you plan to go against Serbia, it could stay in Budapest (which is already Balkan Front). There is also the 2nd Army (already in the chain of command) in Budapest, remember to send it to the front of your choice. ;)

*alternatively, you can unattach the two Generals (5th and 6th Army) and send them to Budapest (strategically redeploy and by rail) to activate them faster, but I prefer to move the entire armies near the Serbian front instead... the real offensive can start in two months time when K.u.K. can move...
**von Hötzendorf is an Eccentric Strategist, meaning +1 strategic and +1 initiative for his subordinate Generals... not bad!
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le Anders
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Mon Sep 01, 2014 8:30 pm

Carnium wrote: They did fantastic job at keeping Italians at bay,

In hilly/mountainous terrain...
And beating ITALY isn't exactly an achievement to be proud of...

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Carnium
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Mon Sep 01, 2014 10:08 pm

le Anders wrote:In hilly/mountainous terrain...
And beating ITALY isn't exactly an achievement to be proud of...

With what troops and its quality A-H had to defend against Italy it was an achievement. Italian army was WAY more interested in fighting THAT war than the next one. Their propaganda told the common soldiers that they are "liberating" Italians from A-H rule. Then they were a bit surprised that the "liberated" people didn't speak Italian :D

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Shri
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Tue Sep 02, 2014 3:52 am

True, i agree with your point that the Alpine Troops of Austria performed admirably on the Italian Front for 3+ years facing odds of 2:1.
But in Serbia and Galicia their record was 'Crap'.
Of course, Italians were the 'WORST' army of both the World Wars. No imagination, poor leadership, primitive industry etc. helped the Italians surrender faster and faster when attacked. (CAPORETTO)
Austria was on paper a Great Power, so comparing potential to actual; translation of power was minimal.
Russia too faced similar issues- potential to actual conversion problems; but they beat the Austrians and Turks easily.

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