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Zardoz
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Caesar's too strong!

Sun Jun 04, 2017 8:49 am

Hi all

I need some clues on how to adjust my army composition based on the 'battle report' data given by the game. As you can see from the attached pictures my Pompeian 24k man army got whacked by Caesar's 10k man army. :cuit:

But why exactly? I can see that I was up against a better general and that I had no impedimentia (which always seems to make a difference). But what else can I conclude from the data shown?

Some suggestions on what are the most important data points in these pics would be very much appreciated.

thanks
Tony

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Zardoz
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Re: Caesar's too strong!

Sun Jun 04, 2017 8:55 am

and yes I'm off to study this...
viewtopic.php?t=26392

and it has reminded me to ask for instructions to generate the most detailed combat log. :dada:

delcastel
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Re: Caesar's too strong!

Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:25 am

le niveau de moral national a une grande importance pour les combats. Votre moral national est a combien ?

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Zardoz
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Re: Caesar's too strong!

Mon Jun 05, 2017 1:01 pm

Hi delcastel

Yes, national morale is very important in battles. In this case, but, my national morale is higher than Caesar's as you can see from the attached picture. I think the answer lies in the forum thread linked in my second post - the relative abilities of the general and the experience levels of the legions really do make a very significant difference. I'm still studying the numbers in that thread, but. What experiences have you had in the game?

cheers

Tony

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Khanti
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Re: Caesar's too strong!

Mon Jun 05, 2017 5:16 pm

Zardoz wrote:(...)

and it has reminded me to ask for instructions to generate the most detailed combat log. :dada:


Just look at combat log in game's folder Alea Jacta Est\AJE\Logs\. There could be an answer.
Your legions should have the same level of experience (Lucius Afranius starts with 3-stars Spanish legions).
Caesar's legions should be 3-stars (X Legio) and 1 or 2-stars (XV Legio).

So I suppose: terrain (woods/road) or commander (3-2-3 vs 6-4-5).

Did you attack Theava from Salduba (river crossing)?
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Durk
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Re: Caesar's too strong!

Tue Jun 06, 2017 3:24 am

Quality of leadership combined with troop quality and training make a huge difference. Playing as Pontus I had a 75,000 plus force of Greek and Asian troops against Sulla's 15,000 valued force of trained legions. Sulla won. While this is a bit of an extreme situation, Caesar like Sulla with trained legions is a god.
To beat Caesar you must defeat his other armies while training your troops and gaining experience. In other words, avoid Caesar instead of confronting him.

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Khanti
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Re: Caesar's too strong!

Tue Jun 06, 2017 3:51 pm

1. The commander here is Caius Fabius, not Caesar himself.
2. Legions training level should be similar. Both side's legions are similar.
3. "To beat Caesar you must defeat his other armies while training your troops and gaining experience." - he tried it, but failed :confused:
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arsan
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Re: Caesar's too strong!

Tue Jun 06, 2017 10:36 pm

For what I remember, there are several models for legions and Caesar veteran legions from the Gaul conquest are much better even than the good Spanish legions Pompey has on Spain.
Besides the experience difference, they have different stats...
Not all legions units are born equal... ;)
Check for instance how crappy Pompey oriental legions are!
I agree with Durk: try to avoid fighting Caesar and his veterans. Keep them distracted and try to win the war on the theatres where they aren't. But this is easier said than done!

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Durk
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Re: Caesar's too strong!

Wed Jun 07, 2017 3:00 am

Playing as Pompey is always a supreme challenge. I had one pbem opponent who actually 'cracked the nut' on how to win as Pompey (I cannot say I can recreate his fine play).
What he essentially did was play the early game without territorial aims. This is a bit of a challenge given the game rewards territorial possession in many ways. What he did was show up where my Caesar was not, win a battle and disappear. Classic Fabian strategy. Then he expanded this to the naval war. Soon Caesar was without a plan, just chasing a ghost.
So yes indeed it is a hard strategy to play, not fighting Caesar until your units are trained fighting his allies, but in my view, it is the only way to win as Pompey.

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Zardoz
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Re: Caesar's too strong!

Fri Jun 09, 2017 1:12 pm

So yes indeed it is a hard strategy to play, not fighting Caesar until your units are trained fighting his allies, but in my view, it is the only way to win as Pompey.


Yes indeed it is a hard strategy which is why I'm starting to really enjoy these games. A damn fine system you've created.

I can see that my approach as Pompey is wrong or wrong-ish. Building up legions and blooding them in simple battles before sending them up against Caesar does seem to be a key. I have been paying too little attention to the stats - especially experience - of my units and just trying to take back the ground.

Still I'm not doing too badly. I've got a foothold in Italy again thanks to an amphibious landing. That worked really well.

One other thing I've noticed is that the game engine collects a lot of Caesar's forces into one big army and one big navy and moves them round crushing my smaller forces. "Firefighting" I'd call it. Does this always happen?

Did you attack Theava from Salduba (river crossing)?
I believe we were both in an open terrain province, but I'd have to check back to be sure.

But I will open the combat log after each turn and study it carefully.

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James D Burns
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Re: Caesar's too strong!

Fri Jun 16, 2017 4:31 am

I think 4 legions is too much for a 2 star leader to command without penalties, what is your command penalty on the pop-up when you mouse over the stack. A high penalty will mean your units preform poorly and they will route a lot sooner in battle than normal and this may be the issue here.

Jim

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