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Narwhal
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Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:13 pm

FritzKraut wrote:hi guys, i just played a 56 campaign until 58 and the russians have withdrawn all their forces back home and refuse to take part in this war.

the french also havent done much but russia didnt even conquer königsberg.


I have got the same problem. I can quite easily crush the Russian army in front of Königsberg (I explained to Clovis how to - not sure if he changed anything) and I usually siege Stralsund before the Swedes become a nuisance, so I have no true Northern Front.
With the Wedel reinforced and some luck, the French can also be horribly sluggish on your Eastern front - in that situation you just have the "main" front vs Austria to cope with - easy peasy.

Several solutions :
- Do not reinforce Wesel, forced yourself not to destroy the RUssians using their weakness in supply
- Play at a later date.
I would play at a later date, but I believe the Austrian AI does not work for non 1756 start as of yet...

I would be cool, btw, if the Swedes could land somewhere else than Stralsund (random Northern city, whether it is controled or not).

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Clovis
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Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:19 pm

Narwhal wrote:I have got the same problem. I can quite easily crush the Russian army in front of Königsberg (I explained to Clovis how to - not sure if he changed anything) and I usually siege Stralsund before the Swedes become a nuisance, so I have no true Northern Front.
With the Wedel reinforced and some luck, the French can also be horribly sluggish on your Eastern front - in that situation you just have the "main" front vs Austria to cope with - easy peasy.

Several solutions :
- Do not reinforce Wesel, forced yourself not to destroy the RUssians using their weakness in supply
- Play at a later date.
I would play at a later date, but I believe the Austrian AI does not work for non 1756 start as of yet...

I would be cool, btw, if the Swedes could land somewhere else than Stralsund (random Northern city, whether it is controled or not).


No I didn't change anything for now. I'm thinking about.
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Clovis
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Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:28 pm

By the way, about AI. I tested it with the following settings: normal aggro, normal difficulty, more time for AI and +2 fog of war bonus. I should urge to play with these settings, especially the last. AI is very challenged when it hasn't some info about enemy forces ( and is very challenged when it gets these infos!) I've noticed since AACW how much this slight bonus is improving AI behaviour...
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Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:42 pm

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Clovis
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Sat Oct 09, 2010 11:50 pm

Gray_Lensman wrote:Pardon me Clovis but stating the AI is very challenged is confusing. In English the use of the term in that manner can be taken to mean the AI has some difficulty when using "those infos". No offense meant in asking for the clarification.

Do you mean that the AI is more of a challenge when it has certain info?

OR

Do you mean that the AI is less of a challenge when it has certain info?


the first. AI is better

Thanks!
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Clovis
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Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:11 am

Gray_Lensman wrote:Interesting... I was always under the assumption that IF the AI got to much "other side" info, that it did irrational things like overly deep raids.

It could be however that the deep raids were an accidental result of retreating in the wrong direction towards larger enemy structures and this new increased info could make the AI more challenging now that the retreat issue bug might be squashed.

Do you definitely know if you have evaluated your AI routines against a game engine that has this retreat bug squashed? I'm not at all certain that it was fixed prior to this ROP patch or the AACW beta7 patch.


You're wrong: deep raids are tied to regional values. Diminushing AI values for regions far away will almost stop in depth raiding. I've experienced this since AACW 1.07. :)
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Narwhal
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Sun Oct 10, 2010 9:01 am

Clovis wrote:By the way, about AI. I tested it with the following settings: normal aggro, normal difficulty, more time for AI and +2 fog of war bonus. I should urge to play with these settings, especially the last. AI is very challenged when it hasn't some info about enemy forces ( and is very challenged when it gets these infos!) I've noticed since AACW how much this slight bonus is improving AI behaviour...

+2 FoW bonus means the third box or the second one ?

In any case, the default config when you first reflect the game AND the toolbo should reflect this. (You have selected HIGH bonus. this is the default configuration).

Does the AI work with a start other than 1756 (and maybe 1757) ?

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Clovis
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Sun Oct 10, 2010 10:14 am

Narwhal wrote:+2 FoW bonus means the third box or the second one ?

In any case, the default config when you first reflect the game AND the toolbo should reflect this. (You have selected HIGH bonus. this is the default configuration).

Does the AI work with a start other than 1756 (and maybe 1757) ?



The third.

The decision about default AI FOW level is IMHO in AGEOD hands. the decision could have business side effects as some players could resent this as AI cheating. After having studied AI behaviour since 2 years, I jsut think AI needs more info than any human to do the right moves. And I prefer largely playing against an AI knowing a little more about my forces than setting difficulty up, which give AI advantages for battles and other stuff.

Notf or now. Sooner than I expected ;)
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AI Hotfix for all Campaigns

Sun Oct 10, 2010 11:05 am

AI events will be active for all Campaigns:


Unzip directly into your Rise of Prussia folder
10 Files will be overwritten in the \RoP\Events Folder
JSGME format compatible
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Baris
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Sun Oct 10, 2010 12:11 pm

Thanks Lodilefty.

Clovis I have played with medium fog bonus against ai Prussia before hotfixes(turn 30) Frederick marched and siege some forts around Bavaria, but ran out of supply after some point and defeated by French. He had 4 or 5 supply wagons all depleted including most elements. If he could have conquered Nuremberg there would be no problem. But plan B should be building depots somewhere near maybe if in case there was a failure in siege. It was not winter so he could have move the troops where he can get supply. Winter quartering or concentrating of forces of ai working well but ai not building a depot can be somehow hampering AI to play effectively. (I dont know if there is any ai helper event about supply)

Edit: I have loaded Prussian ai, there were maybe 50 notification about elements disappeared from lack of supply.

Last edit: I have counted 103 notifications :)

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Sun Oct 10, 2010 1:04 pm

Baris wrote:Thanks Lodilefty.

Clovis I have played with medium fog bonus against ai Prussia before hotfixes(turn 30) Frederick marched and siege some forts around Bavaria, but ran out of supply after some point and defeated by French. He had 4 or 5 supply wagons all depleted including most elements. If he could have conquered Nuremberg there would be no problem. But plan B should be building depots somewhere near maybe if in case there was a failure in siege. It was not winter so he could have move the troops where he can get supply. Winter quartering or concentrating of forces of ai working well but ai not building a depot can be somehow hampering AI to play effectively. (I dont know if there is any ai helper event about supply)

Edit: I have loaded Prussian ai, there were maybe 50 notification about elements disappeared from lack of supply.

Last edit: I have counted 103 notifications :)


I didn't created AI helper events for supply, but if there's no improvments on this point , I will. Thanks for the input.
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Baris
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Sun Oct 10, 2010 1:16 pm

Yes, There was a same problem in WIA,I have remembered Pocus said there can be need for AI helper event. Especially for large stacks there can be some need. But overall it is challenging and AI is improved from previous patches. Thanks for your work.

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Charles
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Sun Oct 10, 2010 1:34 pm

now for some good AI news. July 1757, after capturing Prague, I am trying to see if I can drive directly on Vienna, but Daun shows up with a 5,000 point army to threaten my supply line:

Image


this is with just the hotfix that was released yesterday and a +1 FOW bonus. :)
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FritzKraut
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Sun Oct 10, 2010 3:04 pm

here is the ScriptReport.txt from my game where the russians failed to conquer königsberg and have withdrawn back home, refusing to participate in the war.

played with the latest beta patch but without the ai_events & latest ai_hotfix.

i hope the attchment shows up, i cant reach the forums so i have to use a proxy which causes some troubles
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Ebbingford
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Sun Oct 10, 2010 10:24 pm

It looks like some leaders are still not displaying properly, this column should be showing Schwedt's portrait on the map should it not?

Image

Save attached if needed.
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Charles
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Mon Oct 11, 2010 1:58 pm

the AI aggressiveness appears to be all over the map. In my game, early august 1757:

-in the east, the Russians are driving towards Konigsberg;
-in the south, Daun with a 67,000 man army attacked the main Prussian army of 35,000 men in southern Bohemia; at the same time, a separate 10,000 man Austrian force tried to recapture Prague;
-in the southwest, the ReichArmee has been driving quickly trough Saxony and is now besieging Dresden;
-in the west, the French attacked the main Hannoverian Army at Minden;
-in the north, the Swedes were beaten in front of Stettin last turn, but now a separate force has appeared and is besieging Magdeburg;

so no lack of aggressiveness here. This is without the latest fixes posted by Clovis yesterday, default options, +1 FOW bonus, give the AI more time.
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Clovis
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Mon Oct 11, 2010 3:12 pm

FritzKraut wrote:here is the ScriptReport.txt from my game where the russians failed to conquer königsberg and have withdrawn back home, refusing to participate in the war.

played with the latest beta patch but without the ai_events & latest ai_hotfix.

i hope the attchment shows up, i cant reach the forums so i have to use a proxy which causes some troubles


Indeed, somthing is wrong in the rissian AI after 1757. With RUS insight, I know how to fix that. I will work about ASAP. Thanks for the file.
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Clovis
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Mon Oct 11, 2010 3:38 pm

Charles wrote:the AI aggressiveness appears to be all over the map. In my game, early august 1757:

-in the east, the Russians are driving towards Konigsberg;
-in the south, Daun with a 67,000 man army attacked the main Prussian army of 35,000 men in southern Bohemia; at the same time, a separate 10,000 man Austrian force tried to recapture Prague;
-in the southwest, the ReichArmee has been driving quickly trough Saxony and is now besieging Dresden;
-in the west, the French attacked the main Hannoverian Army at Minden;
-in the north, the Swedes were beaten in front of Stettin last turn, but now a separate force has appeared and is besieging Magdeburg;

so no lack of aggressiveness here. This is without the latest fixes posted by Clovis yesterday, default options, +1 FOW bonus, give the AI more time.


Good to hear. AI may vary in aggressiveness from game to game, that's WAD
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lodilefty
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Mon Oct 11, 2010 6:05 pm

Charles wrote:the AI aggressiveness appears to be all over the map. In my game, early august 1757:

-in the east, the Russians are driving towards Konigsberg;
-in the south, Daun with a 67,000 man army attacked the main Prussian army of 35,000 men in southern Bohemia; at the same time, a separate 10,000 man Austrian force tried to recapture Prague;
-in the southwest, the ReichArmee has been driving quickly trough Saxony and is now besieging Dresden;
-in the west, the French attacked the main Hannoverian Army at Minden;
-in the north, the Swedes were beaten in front of Stettin last turn, but now a separate force has appeared and is besieging Magdeburg;

so no lack of aggressiveness here. This is without the latest fixes posted by Clovis yesterday, default options, +1 FOW bonus, give the AI more time.


Also note that the Event bugs we HotFixed were entirely for Prussian AI. The Austrian AI events were OK. :w00t:
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Ebbingford
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Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:03 am

The number of prisoners being reported after a successful siege is still way out. I just had the report that 1 unit had surrendered for the lose of 1 NM and 10,000 prisoners had been taken. The unit that surrendered was only the Hanoverian jaegers. On the F5 page of the ledger where it gives the total number of prisoners held it looks like the correct amount has been used. It is just the message that is generated is out by about x10.

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Pocus
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Thu Oct 14, 2010 4:40 pm

This is indeed a display error, I changed the wording of the messages to indicate capture of hundreds and not thousands (that was written with ,000 prisoners)

Thanks Ebbingford
Image


Hofstadter's Law: "It always takes longer than you expect, even when you take into account Hofstadter's law."

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Ebbingford
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Wed Oct 20, 2010 12:04 pm

This is probably for Clovis.

Playing as Austria, long campaign, +2 detection for AI and "Give AI more time".
The Prussian AI marched and took Pilsen with a large force and then went through the mountain pass in Cham to emerge and take Regensburg. A small force then went to lay siege to Passau and take Munchen. The main Prussian army under Fred then went to Nuremberg where it has remained laying siege to the Reicharmee. It is now late Jan 1758 and most of the Prussian forces have disappeared from lack of supply in the snow.
The bold thrust from the AI is quite good, I lost half of the Reicharmee, and still might lose the other half :D , but there seems to have been no reaction to winter setting in, the AI has carried on campaigning regardless.
I can post saves from the game if needed.

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Clovis
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Wed Oct 20, 2010 12:49 pm

Ebbingford wrote:This is probably for Clovis.

Playing as Austria, long campaign, +2 detection for AI and "Give AI more time".
The Prussian AI marched and took Pilsen with a large force and then went through the mountain pass in Cham to emerge and take Regensburg. A small force then went to lay siege to Passau and take Munchen. The main Prussian army under Fred then went to Nuremberg where it has remained laying siege to the Reicharmee. It is now late Jan 1758 and most of the Prussian forces have disappeared from lack of supply in the snow.
The bold thrust from the AI is quite good, I lost half of the Reicharmee, and still might lose the other half :D , but there seems to have been no reaction to winter setting in, the AI has carried on campaigning regardless.
I can post saves from the game if needed.


Thanks, I will look at; I hope to upload new AI files next week as I'm currently hurrying RUS work. There's definitly a rather recurrent problem for AI not leaving sieges in spite of Winter. sometimes AI does, sometimes not and I've yet to discover a solution..

Edit: i think I've got a possible fix ;)
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Charles
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Wed Oct 20, 2010 9:18 pm

In my game vs Austrian AI, +1 FOW bonus, now up to june 1758.

The AI was very aggresive late in 1757, however, all armies went into winter quarters in december: The Austrian army in Prague (my cavalry found an 8,000 pts army there in the spring); Russians in Konigsberg, although they started moving back towards Russia in feb-mar. 58 (supply issues?); Swedes to Swedish Pomerania; French back to France. It works although the AI waits a 1-2 turns into winter before moving.
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Clovis
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Thu Oct 28, 2010 12:20 am

The new AI files will be ready Sunday :)
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Clovis
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Fri Oct 29, 2010 3:03 pm

Today I should have been doig some shopping and cultural activities in Paris. I should have travelled by rail this morning. Strikes, it was said, were almost over...Almost. So I'm at home and I got some time to clean ROP AI files.

So, here the xls files. Beware, they are only compatable with the next beta patch, due to a fix for a script command (chgAggo)

If you want to test immediatly a version compatable with the current beta patch, you will find the sct files ( those used in game) here:

http://cid-f2e0d7dbcedffac0.office.live.com/self.aspx/.Public/ROPAI.zip

It has been a real pleasure to work on ROP, a very fine game. Even those like me, without a real interest for lacey wars, should give a try to ROP,as the game engine excellence is delivering a very fun gaming experience

Note: any question on the sct files or their use until the next patch will only be replied on my blog ( check the adress below)
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Baris
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Fri Oct 29, 2010 3:58 pm

Thanks Clovis,
I heard the strikes in TV and a friend of mine told me about it that started in september.
I hope you continue to support ROP as it is very good game.
As there is no ETA for the beta patch, I will test the compatible one, greetings.

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