elxaime
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The Swedish Wipeout

Thu Aug 25, 2016 5:19 am

Just curious how Austrian side players in PBEM handle Sweden. In the game, their army is isolated in the north, locked for the first few turns. Even if you get the major reinforcement, their corps commander cannot be used because there is no nearby army. Their uncommanded force is commanded by leaders with zero skills, literally. Despite command of the sea, the game gives you no transports, so you can't leave Stralsund even if you want to. Marching the Russian or Reichsarmee three star up there is possible, I suppose, although that leaves the Russians (and Empire forces) without their own three star.

In the game I am in, the Prussians marched an army twice the size of the Swedes up to Stralsund and have earned about 20 NM beating them down (the remnants of the Swedes are now besieged), while training up Prince Henry some more.

The only thing I can think of doing different is not getting the major reinforcement, letting the Prussians siege (and destroy) the starting Swedish force, then wait for the Prussians to leave and, at some time when perhaps the Russian three-star is close enough to give command, time the big reinforcement for then. That, or getting the aforementioned three-star from the Empire or Russia up there early. But that would see to just delay the inevitable, since the Swedes are so isolated, so terrible and unable to sail away by sea.

Thoughts?

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Durk
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Thu Aug 25, 2016 5:25 am

elxaime wrote:Just curious how Austrian side players in PBEM handle Sweden. In the game, their army is isolated in the north, locked for the first few turns. Even if you get the major reinforcement, their corps commander cannot be used because there is no nearby army. Their uncommanded force is commanded by leaders with zero skills, literally. Despite command of the sea, the game gives you no transports, so you can't leave Stralsund even if you want to. Marching the Russian or Reichsarmee three star up there is possible, I suppose, although that leaves the Russians (and Empire forces) without their own three star.

In the game I am in, the Prussians marched an army twice the size of the Swedes up to Stralsund and have earned about 20 NM beating them down (the remnants of the Swedes are now besieged), while training up Prince Henry some more.

The only thing I can think of doing different is not getting the major reinforcement, letting the Prussians siege (and destroy) the starting Swedish force, then wait for the Prussians to leave and, at some time when perhaps the Russian three-star is close enough to give command, time the big reinforcement for then. That, or getting the aforementioned three-star from the Empire or Russia up there early. But that would see to just delay the inevitable, since the Swedes are so isolated, so terrible and unable to sail away by sea.

Thoughts?


Your idea is sound. Sweden in ROP is in a tough situation if Prussia decides to eliminate them early. The best allies play is to detach a Russian Army Commander to quickly get in range and make the Swedes a subordinate corps of the Russian Army.

However, if Prussia commits to this extermination, then Russia and Hanover have an opening, also.

elxaime
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Thu Aug 25, 2016 5:51 am

Thanks for the response.

In our game so far (late 1757) the near-dead Swedes are besieged by Prince Henry. The Russians have taken Konigsberg, but I forgot to choose the Danzig event so it went neutral and getting supply to get to the scene of the action in central Europe is daunting. Frederick was beaten back from Prague, but has now taken the rest of the Prussian army, joined it with the Hanover army, and is chasing the French back west to the Rhine as they dare not give battle to such a massive host under Freddie. This did leave an opening for Daun, who is across the mountains and about to take Dresden just before winter sets in, as Saxony has been left vacant since and all the Prussians are either at Stralsund or chasing the French. NM is about 125 Prussia 95 Austria. Prussia got about 20 NM from slaughtering the Swedes, and was still getting 8-10 NM per battle Daun even when he was holding them off.

On the bright side, combat losses are 113 k Austria side and 95k Prussia, which I assume is a good thing since they are pretty close and I am told Prussia has trouble replacing losses.

I think my opponent intends to gather all the forces on the map under Frederick and create a sort of Death Star. I assume the best Allied strategy in such a situation is to avoid battle unless the Russians can find some way to get across the wasteland.

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loki100
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Thu Aug 25, 2016 7:02 am

Durk wrote:Your idea is sound. Sweden in ROP is in a tough situation if Prussia decides to eliminate them early. The best allies play is to detach a Russian Army Commander to quickly get in range and make the Swedes a subordinate corps of the Russian Army.

However, if Prussia commits to this extermination, then Russia and Hanover have an opening, also.


The alternative to this is there are some weak Austrian generals with the HRE trait, they can go to Pommerania to provide command for the Swedes.

If you fear your opponent is committing to destroying the Swedes your best plan is to hide in Stalsrund and hope. Its a hard fortress to take as the Prussians are short on siege artillery so its hard to get the breaches needed (there is a nasty trick they can use with fortress guns but I'll let everyone work that out themselves :) ). Also winter makes it hard for them to siege - they can but they need a lot of supply wagons (again a diversion). So a committed Prussian effort will always neutralise the Swedes.

re Danzig it will almost always go neutral, whatever choice you make the Prussians can force this outcome, so thats not unusual and you then need to make your way over Poland. Getting the Russians and their powerful siege capacity into play is vital - especially if your opponent is playing the 'freddie-death star (or pacman) strategy. That can eat its way in the north while the Austrians push into Silesia and Saxony. As you are doing the solution is to advance where Freddie isn't and try to keep all three main allied armies intact.

Don't worry about the NM, that ratio is pretty normal. If you have the resources, build some artillery - the relative lack of this is one reason why the Prussians inflict fairly high losses in battle.

Also, the Prussian army only gets weaker, it can almost never recover its losses, so play for attrition.
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bob.
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Thu Aug 25, 2016 4:34 pm

I'm the Prussian player in that game. Interesting discussion. I won't say what my further strategy for the game is but it seems to me that taking out the Swedes before the Russians cross Poland is very important. With the Swedes having such terrible command I think if the Russians can integrate them into their army their effective strength might well be doubled. So better to get them put of the way ASAP.

That said, the opportunity cost for this is very high. If I had kept the troops attacking Sweden south I think I could keep the Austrians and French at bay for the year (1757). And losing Saxony will hurt for sure.

elxaime
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Thu Aug 25, 2016 8:46 pm

Just curious about Poland historically. Most games make Poland seem like a terrible place with no food. Was it that bad? How did the Poles live and maintain their independence? I realize they did lose independence for a while, but at one time they had a huge Polish-Lithuanian empire. Like everyone else here, I suspect, I am eagerly awaiting Wars of Succession to see what Poland looked like when they were still somewhat powerful.

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