Omnius
Lieutenant Colonel
Posts: 290
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 2:15 pm
Location: Salinas, CA

Mud Ruins 1809 Danube Scenario

Fri Feb 04, 2011 3:32 pm

I'd have to say my least favorite scenario is the 1809 War on the Danube scenario. Mud ruins what could have been a great scenario. There's just no way that the weather works for this scenario so that players can replicate history. The beginning of the scenario is ruined by mud as it disallows players from replicating the early battles of Abensberg and Eckmuhl in late April because neither side can get what historically was around Regensberg the last week of April there in time. :wacko:

What's really needed is a weather event called "Rain" which would be somewhere between Clear and Mud as far as movement and combat effects go. Mud wouldn't happen in a region unless there's been two consecutive Rain turns or Snow followed by Rain.

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PhilThib
Posts: 13356
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2005 5:21 pm
Location: Meylan (France)

Fri Feb 04, 2011 4:49 pm

The other, simpler, option is to change the weather patterns so that chances of rain is lower at that time...

Nevertheless, Central Europe is not California and in April it usually rains more than half of the time... it may have happened that it was dry and sunny in 1809, but that's not always (far from it) the case.... and this is a game

What could be done would be to have - for historical scenarios and as an option only - the historical weather. It would be less a game, but more accurate for those who want to be closer to historical conditions, even if this means they now in advance the weather (something the Emperor never could! ;) )
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Omnius
Lieutenant Colonel
Posts: 290
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2007 2:15 pm
Location: Salinas, CA

Not Sunny California

Sat Feb 05, 2011 4:14 pm

PhilThib,
Europe definitely doesn't have the same kind of sunny weather we have in California. Right now around my area of central CA in Salinas CA we're experiencing beautiful 70+ degree F temps but unfortunately we're being shorted our winter rain the past month.

When I lived in Oberammergau Germany in the 60's I certainly remember that it snowed in June there. It wasn't much and didn't last long on the ground.

I think the problem is there's no middle ground between clear and mud turns, either you can move around normally or you're stuck in the mud. The problem is so many mud turns in the spring and fall. In the 1809 scenario there's so much mud for so many turns that it bogs the game down from anything like the historical timetable. Having middle ground Rain turns would slow down movement somewhat but would allow for something like historical timetables to be met.

While I favor somewhat historical weather modeling on a first turn of a scenario I really don't want it to be so predictable. I think the solution lies in the frequency of mud happening, it happens far too often and really bogs the game down. In my two games of 1809 War on the Danube I had mud almost every turn almost everywhere for atleast 10 turns, well into June before it cleared up. There really wasn't much of a mud problem for slowing down marching around the Danube despite the fact that the Danube was flooding at the time.

I think it's a matter of looking at each scenario's timeframe and figuring out the frequency of weather and then using that info to set more realistic percentages of any particular weather type happening. That way we can have the best of both worlds with unpredictable weather but realistic for that scenario. One weather model doesn't work as weather patterns differ from year to year so weather percentages should be annualized to better fit that year's weather particulars. ;)

Arnaud_Bouis
Sergeant
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 2:51 pm

Mon Jan 07, 2013 5:08 pm

I happen to be a meteorologist by profession. So, if AGEOD needs help to make realistic weather tables, I can help.

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Sorel
Captain
Posts: 184
Joined: Sun Jan 13, 2008 4:37 pm
Location: Zaragoza, Spain

Tue Jan 08, 2013 7:54 pm

I´m having a similar problem with the 1814 campaign scenario in a pbem. We are using the historical attrition option, and, apart from suffering severe delays in the movements, troops suffer a big number of hits, specially in snow, frozen and (obviously) blizzard conditions. This can be totally logical, but means that movement is almost impossible until mid spring, and, apart from not be able to get the historical "timetable" of the allies offensive, gets the scenario quite boring during quite the half of it.

JWW
Sergeant
Posts: 78
Joined: Wed Jul 09, 2008 11:45 pm

Thu Aug 15, 2013 12:44 am

I'm wondering if there is an answer to this.

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