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Carnium
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Sun Mar 03, 2013 8:10 pm

PhilThib: May I get a good screenshot (=here or on my e-mail) of the regions in Austria, Eastern Italy and the Balkans? Some regions may have a strange cut.

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PhilThib
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Sun Mar 03, 2013 8:51 pm

Will send you by email. I could may be make the complete map available (it's big).

The region cuts were made by a volunteer using the NCP base as a start. It may be tweaked a bit if need be (but not much please)
Image

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Narwhal
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Sun Mar 03, 2013 9:41 pm

Hello,

I got an auditing of the Romanian names. For some of them, the mistake may be because you used the non-Romanian name (say the Hungarian name for Transylvanian), so it all depends on the period depicted :) .

- Temesvar : "Temesvar" is the Hungarian name of "Timisoara", so it all depends on which one you want.
- Petroseni : It should be "Petrosani",
- Virful_Pelagia : My Romanian "assistant" did not know this, so it is not very representative ["Hunedoara" would be better]. We had to check it on the RO Wikipedia. It should be "Virful Peleaga" according to Wikipedia, too. Pelagia is a Morrowind city, though :)
- Portile_di_Fer : It should most probably be "Portile_de_Fier"
- Simpulung : It should be "Cimpulung"
- Ploeisti : It should most definitely be "Ploiesti"
- Otteniza : It should be "Oltenita"
- Turgu_Majurele : It should be "Tirgu_Magurele"
- Moldva : It should be "Moldava" if we are speaking of Moldavia
- Iasy : It should most definitely be "Iasi"
- Tirgu_Oena : It should most probably be "Tirgu Ocna"
- Galatz : "Galatz" is the Hungarian name. The Romanian name would be Galati
- "Stintu_Gheorghe" : It should most probably be "Sfintu_Gheorge"

As a reminder, many of the "t" you see should be "ț" if not for unicode limit, and pronounced "ts/tz". In addition, in romanian a final -i is almost mute (like the -e in French), so Galatz and Galați is written differentely but is pronounced mostly the same.

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Narwhal
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Sun Mar 03, 2013 9:43 pm

Can I get screenshoots of the Romanian region and of the Swedish region ?

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PhilThib
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Sun Mar 03, 2013 10:04 pm

Tomorrow I'll post a link to download the map full size, so you can get a better look
Image

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Carnium
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Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:37 pm

PhilThib wrote:Will send you by email. I could may be make the complete map available (it's big).

The region cuts were made by a volunteer using the NCP base as a start. It may be tweaked a bit if need be (but not much please)


Thanks in advance. As far as I could see from the map posted in 2012 some provinces were way off (=cuts were made too far to the south where Austrian provinces were in Slovenia, Slovenian in Croatia and Bosnia etc). Maybe this was already corrected.

veji1
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Mon Mar 04, 2013 12:45 pm

Just a question regarding smaller rivers, I see for example that in the Low countries the Meuse becomes a major river only very far north, so I hope it will be a minor river further south ? I say this because in 17th/19th century warfare the control of river lines as defensive lines, or flank cover, or even offensive barrier as used by Napoleon both in Italy and in Germany in 1805 and 1806 was a key aspect of war at that time.

And also to go back to a point I raised earlier on, more minor rivers whose crossing can be made easier (no river penalty at all) by control of a fortress or strongpoint would make control of those strategic bridge controling cities( ie Maastricht for example) central to a war plan, just as it was in that time leading to lengthy sieges of such important places.

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marek1978
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Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:57 pm

PhilThib wrote:Tomorrow I'll post a link to download the map full size, so you can get a better look


when can we expect a game using this map?

there are so many 3 words wars to cover

GNW - great northern wars

SIM - state is me - wars of Lous XIV

VVV - veni, vidi, deus vici - wars with ottoman empire

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Narwhal
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Mon Mar 04, 2013 5:14 pm

marek1978 wrote:
VVV - veni, vidi, deus vici - wars with ottoman empire


I would call such a game "Wars on the Gate of Europe", but that may be too long.

I also see a WWI game, here.

wosung
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Mon Mar 04, 2013 7:34 pm

Narwhal wrote: I also see a WWI game, here.


Yeah, me too.

Gen. Monkey-Bear
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Tue Mar 05, 2013 8:47 am

Yup.

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PhilThib
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Tue Mar 05, 2013 9:57 am

Here is a link to a larger version of the map (although not the actual size which is twice as big)

http://ageoddl.telechargement.fr/3rdParty/Napoleon/Large_Europe_Map_v1.rar

Also included the updated excel file for regions, including suggested changes to date
Attachments

[The extension xls has been deactivated and can no longer be displayed.]

Image

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Carnium
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Tue Mar 05, 2013 3:59 pm

No other rivers than Danube?
[ATTACH]21840[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH]21841[/ATTACH]

Some weird cuts and enlarged Slovenian provinces here + duplicated Varazdin.
Legend:
Maribor (SLO) = Marburg (GER)
Varazdin (CRO) = Warasdin (GER)
Novo mesto (SLO) = Neustadtel or Neustadtl (GER)

A comparisment between a 1871 map and this work in progress:
[ATTACH]21839[/ATTACH][ATTACH]21838[/ATTACH]
Attachments
Danube.jpg
danubeMap.gif
Map.jpg
map ageod.jpg

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PhilThib
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Tue Mar 05, 2013 5:20 pm

The minor rivers are added at a later stage. You can send a map with the course of them if you wish (but use the prototype map and try to follow existing borders as much as possible)

Regions/borders fixes: I can't make use of your latest sketch...I suggest that you take a slice of the current (wrong) map, erase whatver name is not good and rewrite the correct one on it. Also, if you really need to alter borders, please do so by redrawing them on the map sketch too

Last Important Comment on Region Names
What you see on the map is a region ALIAS, i.e. something that is used only by the engine, and also by devs/modders when they create the scenarios for example. The names displayed on the game map will be tweaked as part as the STRINGS file, i.e. we can have them changed and adjusted any way we want according to scenarios...for instance, a name in Croatia could be in German in a Napoleonic/preWW1 era and in Croat later on...or vice versa if we make a medieval game here (i.e. before Austrian conquest)...etc...etc...

The most important thing is that the name Alias "rings a bell" to the developper/modder, i.e. good to know its Maribor or Marburg and not 10327 like in the Paradox engine...when I hear/read the 'names' I can find quickly where it is...but number...yeark !!! :bonk: (but the funny thing is that the engine use numbers [UIDs] internally...but no one sees it :D )
Image

ribaluigi
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Tue Mar 05, 2013 5:36 pm

May I just ask you a small question. Is it WAD that two provinces have the same name?

I am referring to Asti: 590 and 606.

Best,

Luigi

wosung
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Tue Mar 05, 2013 6:27 pm

The Map is huge. Because each province / hex is quite small, arguably, you almost can't have *wrong* hex borders. Probably there's not much to criticize here. So it's more about spelling. Names depend on the era in question.

Each province / hex is like approx. 50 x 50 kilometers?! I wonder how it looks like with counters in it and a continuous front. For something like WW1 lots of counter pushing. It'll be a monster of operational maneuvre warfare.

And what about using only a part of the map for a game? Is it possible at all? You don't need Turky or the Caucasus for a TYW game.

Best regards

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Narwhal
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Tue Mar 05, 2013 7:20 pm

wosung wrote:
And what about using only a part of the map for a game? Is it possible at all? You don't need Turky or the Caucasus for a TYW game.

Best regards


Actually, you would need Turkey because Wallachia was a significant player in the 30YW :)

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marek1978
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Tue Mar 05, 2013 10:06 pm

As far as i understand You guys want to use that map as platform for many future games. When aproximetly one can expect such a game?

Baris
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Wed Mar 06, 2013 1:41 am

Some minor: UID
1869: Luleburgaz
1880: Sofulu
1972: Kutahya
1996: Beypazarı
2032: Kırıkkale
2078: Trapzoni
2091: Erzurum
2103: Kızkalesi
2109: Goksu
2118: Kahramanmaras
2120: maras(same as kahramanmaras but add the title"kahraman" after 1922)
2135: malazgirt
1943: Kazdagı
1932: Monemvasia
1898: Igoumenitsa
1859: Uzunkopru
1857: Kardjali or kırcaali
1856: Asenovgrad
1851: Pazarjik

For Ottoman rest is either roman or greek name that didn't change regardless period.
In the south Syrian province names inside Turkish border and the other way round. It is wrong unless intentional for crisis for other time period game ! :mdr:

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PhilThib
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Wed Mar 06, 2013 8:35 am

Thanks. Turkish names fixed
Image

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Erik Springelkamp
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Topology in the Northern Netherlands

Wed Mar 06, 2013 12:56 pm

I think the topology of the regions in the Northern Netherlands is not OK.

Image

Regions Zwolle and Enschede should be connected, as they formed an administrative unity (Overijssel) and were connected through the last millennium.

Region Apeldoorn should separate regions Utrecht and Zwolle, as it belongs to the province (Duchy) of Gelre, and it split the provinces Overijssel and Utrecht, which belonged administratively together for a long period (Bishopric of Utrecht), but were separated by Gelre, a cause of a lot of tension and local wars over time.

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NY Rangers
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Wed Mar 06, 2013 12:56 pm

Corrections to some Finnish/Swedish names:

1602: Mariehamn
1603: Forssa
1611: Porvoo
1615: Virolahti
1619: Kivennapa
1620: Sakkola
1621: Kakisalmi
1624: Savonlinna
1627: Kouvola
1631: Riihimaki
1634: Huittinen

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PhilThib
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Wed Mar 06, 2013 1:35 pm

All changes duly noted. Thanks guys :cool:
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Hospitaller
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Wed Mar 06, 2013 4:06 pm

Baris wrote:1857: Kardjali or kırcaali
1851: Pazarjik


Kardjali (Кърджалl)
Pazardjik (Пазарджик ;)

Baris
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Wed Mar 06, 2013 11:38 pm

After Beylik(principility) of Karaman collapsed, city "kırcaali" formed by those immigrants says the wiki.
http://tr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kırcaali
After balkan wars name could have changed.

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Franciscus
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Thu Mar 07, 2013 1:52 am

The region Braganza is spelled wrongly, the correct one in portuguese is Bragança

But maybe the "ç" is not acceptable ?

Hospitaller
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Thu Mar 07, 2013 7:51 am

Baris wrote:After Beylik(principility) of Karaman collapsed, city "kırcaali" formed by those immigrants says the wiki.
After balkan wars name could have changed.


Even back under Turkish rule it was called Kardjali - that's the name in spelling.The name Kırcaali is in turkish writing. In my opinion Kardjali is the correct form.

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PhilThib
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Thu Mar 07, 2013 8:27 am

Franciscus wrote:But maybe the "ç" is not acceptable ?


Yes, none of those special non-ASCII standard characters are acceptable...like the German ä, ü, ö , the French/portuguese ç, all accented letters, etc, etc... just plain stupid normal letters :D
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Erik Springelkamp
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Thu Mar 07, 2013 9:48 am

784 Leyden should be 'Leiden'. (Leyden is English spelling, Leiden is Dutch spelling).
769 Ghent should be 'Gent'. (similar, English spelling vs. Dutch spelling).
765 Louvain should be 'Leuven' (Louvain is French spelling, Leuven is part of Flemish Belgium).
768 Bruxelles should be 'Brussel' (although here one may have different opinions :-), Brussels is situated North of the language border).

wodin
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Fri Mar 08, 2013 3:22 pm

God I love maps..Like grog Porn...


PhilThib wrote:Well, region naming has been done, but of course some names will need reviewing.

Two files enclosed below:

* The map as is (a reduced version, the actual one is 3 times bigger)
* An excel file with the current region names

Post replies with attachment here for changes
:cool:

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